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Hardwick Board Addresses Infrastructure, Public Services, and Financial Oversight

Original title: Hardwick, MA Board of Selectmen Meeting 9/12/22

These meeting notes are AI-generated and unofficial. They are provided for convenience and are not official Town records or approved municipal minutes. Verify all details using the source video and official Town documents.

Meeting details

Date

September 13, 2022

Duration

1h 46m

Decisions

None recorded

Action Items

11 assigned

Summary

The Hardwick Board of Selectmen convened to discuss critical municipal matters, including the cable contract, the controversial wastewater treatment plant project, and various town operational updates. Key decisions were made regarding funding for unserved cable customers and adjusting the PEG access support percentage. Extensive discussion occurred with the Conservation Commission regarding the wastewater project's location and environmental concerns, with the Board emphasizing the need to proceed due to USDA funding deadlines. Updates on public building maintenance, financial reviews, and committee activities were also provided, alongside a significant issue concerning an unauthorized recycling container contract.

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Discussion Highlights

The Board discussed the cable contract, focusing on the build-out to unserved residential and commercial customers, with an estimated cost of $24,600 for residential and additional costs for commercial properties, particularly one requiring a $15,000 railroad permit.
01:51 02:51 07:03
Discussion included the financial impact of reducing the PEG access support percentage from 4% to 3%, with previous quarterly figures reviewed.
09:48 10:39 15:37
The Board discussed including language in the cable contract for PEG access video origination capability, allowing for a studio in Town Hall, with the associated costs to be borne by the town.
20:23 21:17 22:21
The Conservation Commission expressed concerns regarding the proposed wastewater treatment plant project, specifically its location on the town common, potential environmental impacts such as odors and contamination, and compliance with the Massachusetts Wetlands Protection Act.
43:30 50:26 51:16
The town plans to withdraw the current Notice of Intent (NOI) and submit a new one for the October 19th hearing, as advised by DEP, due to changes in parcel and street names.
41:42 42:29 1:33:51
Concerns were raised about the project's funding, with USDA emphasizing the need to proceed within a five-year timeframe to avoid losing significant federal and state funds, despite potential cost overruns and the project being perceived as 'overbuilt'.
53:28 59:52 1:03:02
The Conservation Commission requested legal opinions from Town Council regarding the implications of a 1998 town vote (Article 22, Page Agricultural Trust) on the common's use for conservation purposes.
44:29 45:56 51:39
A request was made for an operation and maintenance plan for the wastewater facility to address future concerns about leaks, pump failures, and environmental contamination.
1:20:08 1:20:26
A recycling coordinator signed a five-year container contract without proper authority, which the town attorney has deemed null and void, leading to efforts to negotiate a mutual resolution.
1:39:27 1:40:40 1:40:49

Transcript (17,628 words)

Lightly cleaned for readability. Each timestamp opens the video at that point.

00:00:07
Okay so we're going to reconvene the boris luckman uh meeting for monday september 12 2022 at 6 38.
00:00:16
If you would all please join in kelly on nicole and saying the pledge of allegiance i pledge allegiance to the flag of the united states of america and to the republic for which it stands one nation under god indivisible with liberty and justice
00:00:37
[Applause] do we have any visitors comments other than items that were going to be discussed under old business we have the cable build up and contract with
00:01:00
Good how are you thanks for waiting for us no problem
00:01:21
So um nicole the contract has gone to we did have the redline track did you have a chance to look at that i honestly i did not look um thoroughly through it to be honest with you
00:01:40
There wasn't too much that we were tweaking from the last one no i think so the big item we had was that we wanted to talk about the board is to serve to serve all the unserved and then the franchise
00:02:21
One if you do vote on i'll add that to the franchise and that'll be part of the three chapters that's the contract yeah that will fill them up within two years whatever that means okay and what the addresses are what do you think
00:02:40
So we had our proposal was we would build the four we wouldn't we don't do the commercial we would do the four residential and that was a cost and a percentage correct yeah so we would cover so i think the total cost was twenty four thousand six hundred

[00:00:07] okay [00:00:08] so we're going to reconvene the boris [00:00:10] luckman uh meeting for monday september [00:00:12] 12 [00:00:13] 2022 at 6 38. [00:00:16] if you would all please join in [00:00:20] kelly on nicole and saying the pledge of [00:00:22] allegiance [00:00:23] i pledge allegiance to the flag of the [00:00:25] united states of america [00:00:27] and to the republic for which it stands [00:00:30] one nation under god indivisible with [00:00:33] liberty and justice [00:00:37] [Applause] [00:00:39] do we have any visitors comments other [00:00:41] than items that were going to be [00:00:42] discussed [00:00:50] under old business we have the cable [00:00:52] build up and contract with [00:01:00] good how are you [00:01:04] thanks for waiting for us no problem [00:01:21] so um nicole the contract has gone to [00:01:31] um we did have the redline track did you [00:01:32] have a chance to look at that i honestly [00:01:34] i did not look um thoroughly through it [00:01:37] to be honest with you [00:01:39] um [00:01:40] there wasn't too much that we were [00:01:43] tweaking from the last one no i think so [00:01:46] um the big item we had was [00:01:49] that we wanted to talk about the board [00:01:51] is to serve to serve all the unserved [00:01:55] and then the franchise [00:02:21] one if you do vote on i'll add that to [00:02:22] the franchise and that'll be part of the [00:02:24] three chapters that's the contract yeah [00:02:26] that will fill them up within two years [00:02:28] whatever that means okay and what the [00:02:30] addresses are what do you think [00:02:40] so we had our proposal was we would [00:02:44] build the four we wouldn't we don't do [00:02:45] the commercial we would do the four [00:02:46] residential and that was a cost and a [00:02:49] percentage correct yeah so we would [00:02:51] cover so i think the total cost was [00:02:52] twenty four thousand six hundred [00:03:23] yep so twenty four thousand six hundred [00:03:25] and those the addresses [00:03:28] do you mind if i just peek at them [00:03:40] so that's the volume [00:03:45] and then this is going to [00:03:48] be right [00:04:10] i thought there was someone [00:04:26] they could be they might not have chosen [00:04:27] to have our service but they have they [00:04:29] could get service no i i would have [00:04:32] swore on the last build there was [00:04:34] someone at the very end of taylor hill [00:04:35] road that [00:04:37] was unreachable [00:04:40] so some addresses were built up after we [00:04:43] completed our build some people had paid [00:04:45] for them um this is what we came up with [00:04:47] when we went back [00:04:48] okay but i can have construction look at [00:04:50] it again but they [00:04:52] i told them to start from when we were [00:04:58] yeah [00:04:59] if you don't mind just double checking [00:05:01] that one do you have an address [00:05:03] it would be the end of it [00:05:05] it would always be in the berry i think [00:05:12] it's just if we can double check it of [00:05:14] course and maybe like you said they may [00:05:15] have paid for it i don't know yeah i [00:05:17] don't know so this is when i asked them [00:05:19] this is what they came back with just [00:05:20] these addresses i would certainly have [00:05:21] them take another [00:05:32] yeah and i would say [00:05:34] i would service anyone that's unserviced [00:05:37] right just for you know resale value for [00:05:40] right just [00:05:41] if you don't get it now like we're not [00:05:43] getting it we have the funds in the [00:05:46] um [00:05:47] right [00:05:48] so the commercial ones the cost of those [00:05:51] like [00:05:52] you have there are some numbers on here [00:05:54] i don't know so this is that's this is [00:05:56] for the residential [00:05:59] that's my eventual [00:06:02] so these two commercial were [00:06:04] but now this looks like a this is a [00:06:06] commercial because i think that's the [00:06:08] one right [00:06:09] yeah it's got a red that's kind of [00:06:10] that's 15 000 for this one [00:06:13] because there's a real world permanent [00:06:14] problem [00:06:15] so it's a little [00:06:17] it's more time consuming and it gets its [00:06:19] mark let's because because of the [00:06:20] railroad yeah yeah [00:06:22] and then [00:06:25] these two down here the 1550s for these [00:06:41] and then [00:06:58] so for this one it's the 8600 is the two [00:07:00] residential passings yep and then one [00:07:03] commercial customer is an additional 15k [00:07:05] for the railroad crossing so [00:07:08] what i'm assuming is happening they're [00:07:09] going to build up to they would build [00:07:12] to the commerce the residential and [00:07:14] that's the 8600 and then [00:07:16] so all that works going to be done is it [00:07:18] is a gun glove above them [00:07:20] past them [00:07:23] um [00:07:24] they're kind of it's just on the other [00:07:26] side of the road but there is a railroad [00:07:28] crossing so then [00:07:32] 15 000 for the railroad permit that we [00:07:34] would have to get to crossover and to [00:07:36] finish bringing service to them okay [00:07:38] i did have um i asked business services [00:07:41] to reach out to them [00:07:44] to see if they could do anything for [00:07:46] them because sometimes they have [00:07:47] different they have different numbers [00:07:49] metrics but like [00:07:51] we offer [00:07:52] so if any of these are long drops on the [00:07:54] residential [00:07:56] we would credit fourteen hundred dollars [00:07:58] per live drop [00:07:59] i don't know they're not saying they [00:08:00] have i don't know they said well i don't [00:08:02] know they're saying no to these ones so [00:08:04] that wouldn't come right but right [00:08:06] but business services has they can play [00:08:09] around with it they do different things [00:08:10] with their numbers and i think they give [00:08:12] a [00:08:14] seventy five hundred dollar credit [00:08:15] that's a long drop [00:08:16] but that doesn't affect the fifteen [00:08:18] thousand for the railroad that's not [00:08:19] gonna do anything so it doesn't really [00:08:21] matter [00:08:22] and then the other two commercials [00:08:26] um would be 15 30 so it's [00:08:29] so it's the 24th [00:08:31] so it's 24 600 for residential [00:08:34] and then another 30. [00:08:50] we'd be responsible for him i'm gonna be [00:08:52] responsible [00:08:54] so comcast said on the [00:08:56] the residential that we would pay nine [00:08:58] thousand eight hundred forty dollars and [00:09:00] you would pay fourteen thousand seven [00:09:01] sixty [00:09:02] so if you take the fourteen thousand [00:09:04] seven sixty we add the fifty thirty [00:09:14] and then depending what that other [00:09:17] if there is taylor hill road whatever [00:09:18] that cost is i can figure that out and [00:09:21] figure out the math to see because we [00:09:23] cover a portion of that one too [00:09:25] like we do with the other ones [00:09:48] we actually talked about going down yeah [00:09:50] because we haven't been [00:09:52] really utilizing the tiger count right [00:09:54] and it's a fee that just gets pushed [00:09:57] onto the users [00:10:08] do you have the old thing oh [00:10:20] um do you have the old franchise [00:10:22] let me grab mine [00:10:24] now [00:10:39] i think it was four four sounds right [00:10:41] but i don't i think we talked about [00:10:42] going to three yeah it's right here [00:10:56] sure [00:10:58] i would [00:10:59] first make a motion to [00:11:01] allocate 45 000 to 260 out of our peg [00:11:05] account to complete [00:11:07] unserved [00:11:09] commercial and residential customers [00:11:12] and i would [00:11:14] then also make a motion to go from four [00:11:17] percent to three percent [00:11:20] for our um [00:11:23] it's like french [00:11:28] so i will um let's take each motion [00:11:31] so i will second the first motion to [00:11:34] use forty five thousand two hundred [00:11:36] sixty dollars out of a peg account to [00:11:38] provide um service to those that are [00:11:40] unserved in the [00:11:42] residential and commercial [00:11:44] all in favor [00:11:45] aye aye [00:11:47] and um [00:11:49] i'll also second the second motion which [00:11:52] in reducing our peg access support [00:11:59] do you happen to know what the financial [00:12:01] impact would be about yep um [00:12:04] do you have a wi-fi password you can [00:12:05] think of i can only get on guests [00:12:09] because we went through all that in one [00:12:11] of our last meetings yeah i just did for [00:12:13] whatever reason i think about everything [00:12:14] i need [00:12:16] and i can get [00:12:17] carpet yes okay [00:12:24] all right over here [00:12:31] [Applause] [00:13:04] thank [00:13:19] it says yeah the network security no key [00:13:21] it's just hard with guests it's not hard [00:13:23] to secure gaster hardwood wireless [00:13:39] so [00:14:08] [Music] [00:14:21] so [00:14:40] here's [00:14:51] i put that language back in and they're [00:14:53] still listed so you guys you just need [00:14:54] to tell me if you went on this thing [00:15:34] okay so [00:15:37] and four percent [00:15:48] so if we take 20 or 20 21 because i have [00:15:50] all the complete numbers for those [00:15:52] quarters it was ten thousand [00:15:55] three hundred and ten seventy two [00:16:00] ten thousand fifty eight and eighty [00:16:02] cents [00:16:04] ten thousand four four six ninety one [00:16:07] ten thousand four nine three sixty seven [00:16:09] so that is that four percent so [00:16:13] um [00:16:30] i can hold your last name if you use [00:16:31] elastic that's the easiest way to do it [00:16:42] so your last [00:16:59] this [00:17:00] what [00:17:02] i've got [00:17:10] that's why we figured [00:17:12] we could actually [00:17:14] go down [00:17:30] and that fluctuates every quarter of the [00:17:32] numbers you can see fluctuations right [00:17:37] so it's based on the gross [00:17:40] so a check was just received recently [00:17:42] here so look at that [00:17:51] i don't know 42 20 22. okay so i guess [00:17:55] you guys got to check [00:17:56] and the total gross revenue was two [00:17:59] hundred and sixty seven thousand one [00:18:01] hundred and ten dollars and twenty three [00:18:03] cents [00:18:04] so you take three percent of that number [00:18:18] yeah but you're still probably [00:18:19] relatively important for 31. [00:18:22] just fluctuating subscribers [00:18:41] um so this is my only other question if [00:18:43] that street taylor hill road if there's [00:18:45] a house that you guys wanted built [00:18:47] that number could change right would you [00:18:50] want to make it so i don't know how you [00:18:52] guys had to deal with that [00:18:54] i don't know what that number is and i [00:18:55] don't even know if it's the house that [00:18:56] has to be built so [00:18:57] well it's not i mean i think you would [00:18:59] just need to let us know of course yeah [00:19:01] just and we could okay all right [00:19:04] and then the only other [00:19:06] so i just split that and we're just [00:19:08] going to complete our motion so [00:19:10] you made the motion i seconded it all in [00:19:12] favor aye all right [00:19:14] just we don't want them so we're going [00:19:15] to three percent [00:19:17] okay now i'm going to write that one [00:19:24] and then the last contract that was [00:19:25] graduated over the 10 years like you [00:19:27] started at [00:19:28] a lower percent after a couple of years [00:19:30] you guys went up a little bit [00:19:33] did you want to do that [00:19:35] so what do you [00:19:36] to get before well no like under the [00:19:38] last contract it goes on [00:19:44] so in the last contract in years one two [00:19:46] and three you're at two percent [00:19:48] years four five six and seven you're at [00:19:50] three percent in years eight nine and [00:19:51] ten you went to four percent [00:19:58] i think it's time [00:19:59] to go back in [00:20:01] well yeah in ten years yeah ten years [00:20:13] that's the average of [00:20:15] what we did the past three years so [00:20:18] overall we'd be ahead of the game in 10 [00:20:20] years yeah [00:20:23] and then the only other language um in [00:20:25] section 6.5 which is a peg access video [00:20:28] origination capability [00:20:31] we put that back in if you guys wanted [00:20:33] to under the last franchise you could [00:20:35] build video return lines you could go [00:20:37] live or have a studio [00:20:39] in town hall [00:20:40] and when it was due the town said no we [00:20:42] don't want to build it so we had a [00:20:43] letter saying no we're not going to [00:20:44] build it [00:20:45] so that language is still in there [00:20:47] because you guys are talking to you [00:20:48] might want to do it [00:20:50] the way it was going to be paid for was [00:20:52] the cost associated with the [00:20:53] construction activation maintenance of [00:20:55] the pig [00:20:56] access video orientation return line [00:20:58] would be considered franchise related [00:20:59] costs which means when the the [00:21:01] subscribers over the course [00:21:03] so [00:21:05] i took that out i don't know how you [00:21:06] guys want to pay for that i don't know [00:21:07] if you want to put it back on the two [00:21:09] weeks [00:21:10] if we're doing what we're doing now but [00:21:12] do you not want to have the ability in [00:21:14] eight years if you want to [00:21:17] well i don't think it hurts to put it in [00:21:18] yeah if if we're going to do it i mean [00:21:21] it doesn't say we have to but no no no [00:21:22] no you don't have to decide right [00:21:24] but i'm not sure about [00:21:26] um [00:21:32] that's how most towns do it right [00:21:35] no then sometimes we we give them the [00:21:37] figure and then they said they agreed to [00:21:39] pay what it is you know we just work it [00:21:41] out with them [00:21:49] can we leave the language like this as [00:21:51] it is [00:21:52] yeah just [00:21:53] in take out the cost passing it through [00:21:55] i had already i deleted i deleted it [00:21:57] yeah because i tried to bring it to your [00:21:58] attention so you guys would know i did [00:22:00] that yeah um [00:22:01] so that gives us the ability [00:22:04] to [00:22:05] revisit this if we leave this up [00:22:08] yeah i mean just it's all saying is it [00:22:10] upon six months for a notice [00:22:12] we will construct this number so we have [00:22:14] six months from then to do it and at [00:22:16] that time we would give you the cost it [00:22:17] would be on you to pay for it so i guess [00:22:19] we might want to put language at the [00:22:21] cost would be the responsibility of the [00:22:23] town [00:22:36] because if we did it through an frc it's [00:22:38] gonna people would notice it would be a [00:22:40] name [00:22:52] okay [00:22:54] [Applause] [00:22:58] i guess the other thing is the um [00:23:07] the public buildings on the cable system [00:23:10] so these are where [00:23:12] you want to have the the cable the free [00:23:14] cable [00:23:16] so right now we right now we've listed [00:23:18] the fire department the highway [00:23:19] department [00:23:20] are they in the same building or is it [00:23:22] different [00:23:22] two different brightness okay [00:23:24] i don't know what street we don't have [00:23:25] street numbers but the town hall the [00:23:28] youth center but the youth center is [00:23:30] here now right yes okay so it should be [00:23:32] 307 main street [00:23:46] library [00:23:49] np memorial library [00:23:54] are there any other buildings that [00:23:55] should be [00:24:05] recycling [00:24:10] dbw [00:24:14] to recycle it beyond here probably [00:24:20] you have an address [00:24:22] yeah [00:24:41] that's 1.65 [00:24:48] recycling is two zero one one barry [00:24:50] b-a-r-r-e [00:24:52] well so was it hybrid fire department [00:24:55] 165 when you googled it [00:24:58] that's [00:25:00] they're both on peter sham road but they [00:25:02] both can't have the same address [00:25:11] we'll get to the updated [00:25:15] so what i'll have to do with the [00:25:16] recycling just to see if it's a standard [00:25:19] installation like where it is [00:25:35] we would like wi-fi [00:25:40] so if you have cable and you have wi-fi [00:25:43] so what's the straight address in the [00:25:44] townhouse 32 caller [00:25:48] and um eric suggested the page building [00:25:52] is that page memory library [00:25:56] just in case [00:25:57] what is that building [00:26:02] do you know the address i'm looking i'm [00:26:04] looking at that um [00:26:05] it's coming it's like 13 which number [00:26:08] right [00:26:10] that's the townhouse [00:26:12] no that's called page [00:26:16] building um [00:26:29] i can get it for you yeah i'm not it's [00:26:31] not [00:26:38] so is this a pub this is a building [00:26:40] owned by the city yeah [00:26:44] oh it's on berry road so it's on the [00:26:46] corner that's why we thought it was that [00:26:47] common so it's 18 b-a-r-r-e [00:26:53] okay so i'm going to have to have um [00:26:56] my construction team go out and look at [00:26:58] all these new mattresses to make sure [00:26:59] that there's no con that it's a standard [00:27:01] insulation no construction is needed it [00:27:03] should be if there's construction needed [00:27:04] that would be borne by the town if it's [00:27:06] a student institution we'll just take [00:27:07] care of it okay and it's one outlet it's [00:27:10] for cable services it's not [00:27:12] anything else so it's just right [00:27:15] right right you guys exactly 100 yep 100 [00:27:18] you can [00:27:27] probably just reactivating it at that [00:27:29] point then yeah [00:27:31] okay okay yeah so that should be outside [00:27:33] then um [00:27:43] is there a senior center in a separate [00:27:44] building now no [00:27:45] it's it would they go [00:27:57] yeah what about the police [00:28:10] should we add it to the list though so [00:28:13] that it's [00:28:28] but it should be on the list at least [00:28:29] right right [00:28:31] that's the address there that's four oh [00:28:34] one four [00:28:37] it's lower road yeah [00:28:39] it's four so it's four something [00:28:51] that's that main street [00:28:54] no it's lower road [00:28:57] so the co-op is 444 [00:29:05] is it 440 [00:29:07] i'm not sure we have to go [00:29:09] they someone called it i don't know who [00:29:11] he affects them but they probably know [00:29:12] what are you talking about the road in [00:29:16] 401. [00:29:17] the co-op is 4 4401 [00:29:21] right [00:29:24] can't be 401. [00:29:37] oh you're right right [00:29:45] but it might still pop up on google [00:29:51] what was that [00:29:52] again it was [00:30:06] 402. [00:30:19] and what's the page building that's a [00:30:21] public building as well [00:30:24] what does it use for i'm just curious [00:30:27] just for the fair fair for uh orange [00:30:30] jesus has used it in the past the boy [00:30:32] scouts use it girl scouts use it [00:30:43] but it's owned by the top card [00:30:53] um it doesn't hurt [00:31:09] um [00:31:11] i'll make these changes and send it back [00:31:13] to you okay um we have to get on the [00:31:15] council to make sure i can forward an [00:31:17] updated draft to town council to tell me [00:31:19] who it is i don't mind doing that and [00:31:20] say i need it back because we need to [00:31:22] this needs to happen yeah i told him [00:31:24] yeah by october 30th yeah [00:31:41] okay so you'll send an updated direction [00:31:42] yeah i'll send an update draft and i'm [00:31:44] gonna i'll just redline the new stuff [00:31:46] like i'm gonna add in the franchise if [00:31:47] you get it [00:31:48] and the peg access origination will add [00:31:50] costs will be [00:31:52] paid by the town [00:31:54] i'll update the [00:31:56] this list [00:31:58] and i'm going to add um what we're [00:32:00] building okay and then just double check [00:32:02] on that taylor hill road i don't know [00:32:04] yet that's just different in my brain [00:32:06] yeah no absolutely maybe they did do it [00:32:08] on their own [00:32:13] do you know who lives there [00:32:15] okay [00:32:19] oh thank you very much [00:32:24] perfect well get all that taken care of [00:32:26] i'll get it back to you and then [00:32:28] i think israel is there anything else i [00:32:30] don't think so [00:32:32] you guys will get into town council or [00:32:33] do you want me to send it to them as [00:32:35] well no you can send them a call for you [00:32:38] and who do you use for your town council [00:32:40] if you are [00:32:53] i'm sure they're all links over there [00:32:59] thank you thank you very much so we [00:33:01] should be in good shape to have this [00:33:02] done on time okay great which is great i [00:33:05] appreciate that [00:33:08] what will the um time frame of the build [00:33:10] up to be [00:33:12] two years so yeah [00:33:13] we say within two years of signing yeah [00:33:15] so um we won't wait i mean we'll start [00:33:18] doing them as soon as we can you know [00:33:20] we'll apply for the poll licenses [00:33:22] but make ready work is super slow across [00:33:24] the state and that's what delays are [00:33:26] building because the building of this is [00:33:28] very quick for us [00:33:30] but getting out of the licenses and the [00:33:31] applications that takes a while and for [00:33:33] the utilities to do the work they have [00:33:35] to do [00:33:37] so that can take you know i have one [00:33:39] build of williamsburg it's like three [00:33:40] houses we're waiting a year at me credit [00:33:42] already [00:33:43] you know [00:33:44] so [00:33:45] it's tough [00:33:46] and we and we really don't we don't have [00:33:47] any control over that so not utilities [00:33:50] no you don't know so i know [00:33:52] i guess but we have a great relationship [00:33:54] with you so they're good about they keep [00:33:55] us informed so at least we can keep you [00:33:56] informed about what's going but [00:33:58] we like to get these quotes as soon as [00:33:59] we can that's always our goal so [00:34:02] the whole thing will be less than two [00:34:03] years [00:34:05] thank you all very much thank you [00:34:07] all righty we'll be in touch all right [00:34:09] thank you [00:34:11] take care [00:34:13] um [00:34:20] yeah [00:34:22] so in your packet you have [00:34:24] an email from the treasurer that um [00:34:27] they looked at five surrounding towns [00:34:29] and they're all at fifty so [00:34:31] essentially um you know we're just [00:34:33] trying to stay with your times yeah i [00:34:35] would make a motion to increase our [00:34:38] municipal leave to get charged to fifty [00:34:40] dollars [00:34:44] effective immediately [00:34:56] um did we say we're going to defer the [00:34:57] treasurer department of faith [00:35:02] uh under new business approvals the [00:35:04] ghost walk of october 15 2022 rain date [00:35:07] october 16th and discussion after dollar [00:35:09] treats trick-or-treating and date slash [00:35:11] green date [00:35:15] so i did reach out to the chief about [00:35:17] the trail of treats and [00:35:18] trick-or-treating [00:35:20] i believe that [00:35:28] i asked for preference on the date [00:35:30] and [00:35:31] i don't think they care what david is [00:35:34] um [00:35:36] i prefer not to do it on the 31st though [00:35:38] that's it's a monday [00:35:40] saturday [00:35:41] well i think he suggested that either [00:35:43] sunday afternoon um i cannot remember [00:35:46] who he told me he was doing the 30th [00:35:48] i think you said barry [00:35:50] maybe you braintree [00:35:54] um [00:36:03] as long as they have enough coverage [00:36:22] we want to reach out to [00:36:26] to whoever is coordinating the trail of [00:36:28] drinks [00:36:32] sorry i'm struggling with names here who [00:36:34] is it lori mace has done it in the past [00:36:37] yeah do we want to reach out to her and [00:36:38] see dave lies okay maybe we can propose [00:36:42] are you okay with the third sunday the [00:36:43] 30th i'm fine with them yeah [00:36:49] i like that the parents could beat the [00:36:51] kids [00:36:52] and get them dressed and everything yeah [00:36:54] we normally we normally just make sure [00:36:56] that the pd's got coverage so so maybe [00:36:59] you're the 29th or 30th in this passage [00:37:03] i think people adults want to go out on [00:37:06] a saturday [00:37:18] i never thought you could just change it [00:37:20] whatever you wanted well people are [00:37:22] going to go whenever they want and other [00:37:24] towns have [00:37:25] have trick-or-treating on other days so [00:37:28] i mean when i was a kid i certainly [00:37:29] would have liked to have it on the [00:37:30] weekend but they yeah so but it was [00:37:32] always like after school whatever day it [00:37:34] was yeah [00:37:36] so the rancher is setting theirs tonight [00:37:38] they're doing october 30th [00:37:40] but they can handle both pounds on the [00:37:42] same day [00:37:43] so why don't we confirm with more and [00:37:45] then what works best for all of them [00:37:48] that are volunteering to do it so [00:37:50] and then when we kind of would say the [00:37:52] 30th and just yeah [00:37:53] okay [00:37:54] um in terms of the ghost talk on october [00:37:57] 15th is there anything that we need to [00:37:59] do [00:38:01] no i think it was just like you know [00:38:02] happening in public [00:38:05] we like to walk off [00:38:07] comet street [00:38:09] uh as we do for the trick-or-treating [00:38:13] so [00:38:15] the kids you know go across from the [00:38:17] common to the townhouse involved [00:38:20] um [00:38:21] if they put the barriers out for us we [00:38:25] can remove them ourselves [00:38:28] and they can leave them [00:38:30] for the trick-or-treat right out [00:38:34] and just message you and make sure [00:38:35] there's no issue with that yes [00:38:38] so that's it just talked about before [00:38:41] do you want a motion pending pdf [00:38:44] um i would make a motion to approve um [00:38:46] the ghost walk for october 15th of the [00:38:48] rain date of october 16th and also [00:38:51] trails of treats and tricks [00:38:54] or trick-or-treating reference calls [00:38:56] for um [00:38:59] the 30th pending um [00:39:03] lauren is it mace lauren [00:39:06] yeah she already reached out and her [00:39:07] right so just pending that that's good [00:39:09] with their group [00:39:11] of them [00:39:18] [Music] [00:39:26] um so why don't we um it's okay why [00:39:30] don't we [00:39:31] squeeze in [00:39:32] conservation [00:39:36] um [00:39:37] so um [00:39:39] thank you for your [00:39:40] love sorry about that email [00:39:44] i thought the first thing was an apology [00:39:46] for three pagers [00:39:49] so [00:39:51] we got this this afternoon and [00:39:53] based on the concerns [00:39:55] certainly felt like it was appropriate [00:39:56] to have you guys in tonight giving the [00:39:58] time frame that we're under [00:40:00] i know nicole reached out to you and had [00:40:02] a conversation with you about this [00:40:04] earlier today [00:40:05] um [00:40:10] and so we have reached out to um nicole [00:40:14] do you want to talk about who you [00:40:15] reached out to in the discussion [00:40:19] i reached out to [00:40:21] dpc engineering and greg corbo i gave it [00:40:24] to them both for them to review [00:40:26] i didn't get the chance to talk to greg [00:40:29] but dbc engineering [00:40:31] had reached out to [00:40:34] dep [00:40:36] obviously they you know all those guys [00:40:38] know each other and they have [00:40:38] relationships with each other [00:40:40] um [00:40:44] yeah and i can add that dep did call [00:40:46] after that because i had i've talked to [00:40:48] him a couple of times a wetland circuit [00:40:50] rider that [00:40:51] basically gives us guidance [00:40:54] and um [00:40:56] he didn't even call me because he said [00:40:58] he would call [00:40:59] to acknowledge you know [00:41:01] if he got into any more conversation or [00:41:03] discussion and they did call it [00:41:06] so i knew that yeah [00:41:08] um who's greg [00:41:10] he's the is he no not greg yeah he's our [00:41:12] attorney but justin skelly from dpc [00:41:15] engineering is who i spoke with today [00:41:17] yeah justin and jeremy i know that part [00:41:19] i was just trying to remind myself of [00:41:21] what the name greg was he's our he's our [00:41:23] counsel for this project [00:41:24] not for the whole not for everything in [00:41:26] town but just specific for this project [00:41:28] and um so [00:41:30] uh [00:41:32] justin spoke with dep [00:41:34] and said that [00:41:37] um [00:41:39] he he's he does want them to so they [00:41:41] want [00:41:42] the town to withdraw the noi because [00:41:45] it's it's partly changed so the parcel [00:41:48] changed the street name change and they [00:41:50] should just have a new dep file number [00:41:52] so um that's no problem with that it's [00:41:55] not going to affect [00:41:57] um them you know it's not any extra work [00:41:59] because a lot of this stuff has become [00:42:01] extra work for them [00:42:02] over the past few months that costs us [00:42:05] more money so [00:42:06] um [00:42:07] he said he mentioned that the proposed [00:42:09] construction work is pretty [00:42:10] straightforward buffer zone work from a [00:42:12] wetlands permitting standpoint [00:42:15] and [00:42:16] he you know obviously hopes that the [00:42:18] controversial nature doesn't affect the [00:42:20] review of the project it should just be [00:42:22] in relation to the wetlands protection [00:42:24] act and he's echoed the sentiment to [00:42:26] um conservation so we are going to [00:42:29] withdraw the noi [00:42:30] and submit a new noi for that you know [00:42:33] to make the deadline for the october [00:42:35] 19th hearing [00:42:36] um [00:42:38] and so that's [00:42:39] what we are going to [00:42:42] uh go with now so we're still gonna [00:42:44] we're still going on with our with our [00:42:46] bidding [00:42:47] um [00:42:48] we need this permit before the shovel [00:42:50] goes in the ground so that won't be [00:42:52] until early spring [00:42:53] um [00:42:55] so [00:42:56] with that being said um you know a lot [00:42:59] he he did say that a lot of these [00:43:01] concerns weren't conservation concerns [00:43:03] that they you know their jurisdiction is [00:43:06] the wetlands and you know some of those [00:43:09] things have been answered in the past [00:43:10] that i have the answers to such as odor [00:43:13] so those are you know that's kind of [00:43:14] like old news yeah so you and i talked [00:43:16] about a bunch of this so since i pushed [00:43:19] the three-page memo on you guys um at [00:43:21] the last minute here well not so much at [00:43:23] the last minute but it was in time for [00:43:25] this meeting which makes it last minute [00:43:27] for this meeting [00:43:29] um [00:43:30] so let me say that this was just me [00:43:32] trying to get out some of what's been [00:43:34] going around in my head [00:43:36] you know we feel kind of nicole heard [00:43:39] this for me already [00:43:41] you know that [00:43:43] there's been a lot of discussion about [00:43:44] the project over time we've all been [00:43:47] involved in meetings you've invited us [00:43:48] to select board meetings and [00:43:50] presentations [00:43:52] but we never got to the point of [00:43:54] specifics for [00:43:55] our from our point of view [00:43:58] and so in wetland permitting right [00:44:00] so now we're there and it's right down [00:44:02] to the last minute right down to the [00:44:03] wire and we're feeling the pressure [00:44:05] because there's [00:44:06] a couple of things going on for us [00:44:09] one is we have our responsibilities [00:44:11] under the massachusetts wetland [00:44:12] protection act right [00:44:16] which [00:44:17] are [00:44:18] we'll say that's that's one [00:44:20] responsibility here another thing [00:44:22] recently that we've been wrestling with [00:44:24] is these memos as we discussed um [00:44:29] article 22 which was a the result of a [00:44:32] town boat [00:44:34] back in 1998 [00:44:37] the associated memo which i think was [00:44:39] right after that whether it was in 98 or [00:44:42] 99 but it was the page agricultural [00:44:44] trust [00:44:45] so we have these things and [00:44:49] that's a separate thing from our wetland [00:44:50] responsibilities and we're trying to [00:44:52] figure out you know what [00:44:54] what those responsibilities might have [00:44:56] been that we were signed [00:44:59] and we need some opinions on that that's [00:45:02] why i [00:45:03] basically requested [00:45:06] legal opinions [00:45:11] because i can see [00:45:12] that i was really [00:45:15] pretty [00:45:16] pretty afraid of walking into a [00:45:18] september meeting [00:45:20] and having a room full of people [00:45:23] expecting us to interpret that [00:45:25] you know what does that mean do we have [00:45:27] responsibility for [00:45:29] that side of the common [00:45:31] what does conservation purposes mean [00:45:32] what about the page agricultural trust [00:45:36] i don't know much about the agricultural [00:45:38] trust but i do know enough to know that [00:45:40] they were elected so i'm not sure what [00:45:41] that meant so [00:45:43] that's why that's why you see my list [00:45:46] our list [00:45:47] which i tried my best to capture [00:45:51] last night on paper [00:45:53] asking for some involvement of town [00:45:56] council can we get some opinion on these [00:45:58] things [00:45:59] and of course there's always the [00:46:02] very first thing i mentioned was the [00:46:04] fact that of course as you know [00:46:06] we have um [00:46:08] and this gets back to something you said [00:46:10] to me on the phone [00:46:12] about [00:46:13] the number of people on our board right [00:46:14] we have three members on our board [00:46:17] and you and i talked about a quorum and [00:46:18] we said well we have to be a little [00:46:20] careful because we have two members and [00:46:22] we were thinking that was horrible [00:46:24] well that's not really true because [00:46:25] officially we have a five-member board [00:46:27] unfortunately for us we're down to three [00:46:29] people [00:46:31] so we need three people for a quorum we [00:46:33] don't have the luxury of having somebody [00:46:35] be sick we have to end up canceling a [00:46:37] meeting [00:46:39] we lost our fourth person we didn't have [00:46:41] a five [00:46:42] person for a long time we lost our [00:46:44] fourth [00:46:45] member [00:46:46] nick [00:46:47] because of health reasons and so then we [00:46:49] were down to three and so we have to do [00:46:51] something about that [00:46:53] but anyway we don't have a quorum [00:46:54] tonight there are two of us here to [00:46:56] answer questions about this or discuss [00:46:59] or just help clarify [00:47:01] we we appreciate [00:47:04] you know anything we can get [00:47:06] as you know becky has [00:47:09] consulted the ethics commission we voted [00:47:12] we voted [00:47:13] we did vote as a board so just to kind [00:47:15] of give you our where we're at where [00:47:17] we're at with this sure [00:47:19] so um we did vote uh last meeting or the [00:47:21] meeting before to the board uh voted to [00:47:27] authorize [00:47:29] the vote [00:47:30] becky to [00:47:31] participate in this decision [00:47:33] we can put something in writing it's in [00:47:35] our minutes yeah i think that's that [00:47:37] would be important to us well actually i [00:47:38] need that disclosure [00:47:40] i know they just didn't sign it at the [00:47:42] last meeting because i wasn't here so [00:47:43] they're signing it tonight and i'll give [00:47:45] you a copy okay this to be [00:47:48] and then one copy will also go in your [00:47:50] conservation file for this project [00:47:52] because this is a very important thing [00:47:55] and i don't want to be accused of [00:47:57] conflict of interest from understood or [00:47:59] understood 100 of them we get it yes [00:48:05] bill also requested um confirmation from [00:48:08] the [00:48:09] um town attorney [00:48:11] that i would like something in writing [00:48:13] can we get something yeah you know he [00:48:15] did he got it at three o'clock this [00:48:17] afternoon so yeah i know but i'm just [00:48:18] saying that i would [00:48:20] really appreciate that [00:48:24] yeah and you know i mean you just got [00:48:26] this [00:48:27] partway drugs early afternoon when this [00:48:30] arrived in your inbox so i don't [00:48:32] we don't expect that you've had time to [00:48:34] really study this or read it and digest [00:48:36] it [00:48:37] it was my attempt to try to lay out for [00:48:39] the record and i know it's long probably [00:48:41] longer than [00:48:42] most people would write [00:48:45] and i'm tired you know [00:48:47] i i'm tired enough to prove that i had [00:48:50] to think this through [00:48:52] how to word some of these things and get [00:48:53] some of these thoughts out of my head [00:48:55] so you know there are two tracks going [00:48:57] on one is our wetland responsibilities [00:49:00] and one is what we may or may not be [00:49:03] responsible for with respect to the [00:49:05] comment those are two things [00:49:07] and then the third thing [00:49:10] really that you have to suffer through [00:49:11] reading or you will suffer through [00:49:12] reading [00:49:14] is [00:49:15] some of the things that we um [00:49:18] expect when we review our projects right [00:49:20] and some of these some of these like [00:49:22] you're aware that for instance we've [00:49:24] been dealing with two commercial solar [00:49:25] projects on the west side [00:49:27] there's been a lot of engineering and [00:49:29] design work for something like that just [00:49:30] like for this just like for the mill [00:49:33] and just [00:49:35] just like say the mcdonald's gravel [00:49:37] proposal [00:49:39] so we end up benefiting from all the [00:49:42] stuff that gets produced for those [00:49:45] submissions [00:49:47] for the other boards [00:49:49] so for instance the gravel proposal you [00:49:51] know a drainage study or the solar [00:49:52] proposal the drainage study the [00:49:54] hydrological stuff the calculations all [00:49:56] of that stuff because some of it does [00:49:58] relate to wetlands and we appreciate [00:50:01] seeing it [00:50:03] so my summarizing that [00:50:06] here um [00:50:09] you know i tried to make the point that [00:50:10] there are some things that stand out in [00:50:12] my mind just as i know they stand out in [00:50:14] your mind the biggest thing would have [00:50:16] been odors [00:50:18] and i mentioned i've been by [00:50:20] sewage treatment pumping stations in [00:50:23] recent times and smelled odors so that [00:50:26] makes me wonder you know what about the [00:50:27] future of the comp [00:50:29] is there engineering that shows how this [00:50:31] plant will operate uh you know i [00:50:33] mentioned things like an operation and [00:50:34] maintenance plant [00:50:36] haven't seen any of that right [00:50:39] maybe you all have or [00:50:41] but but i know i've heard also in the [00:50:43] meetings that of course [00:50:45] the boards that we usually rely on like [00:50:47] the planning board or the board of [00:50:48] health which requires some of this [00:50:51] documentation [00:50:52] they're not apparently participating so [00:50:55] i don't know you know are are these [00:50:57] documents produced by engineers who's [00:50:59] reviewing this [00:51:01] so that we can trust because we haven't [00:51:03] seen it yet [00:51:04] that [00:51:05] it's not going to leak there won't be [00:51:06] blowouts the pump won't go down and the [00:51:09] stream will be contaminated [00:51:11] there will be a ventilation problem and [00:51:12] there's odors on the common those kinds [00:51:14] of things [00:51:16] you know odors on the common are a good [00:51:18] example where that has nothing to do [00:51:20] with wetlands we understand that [00:51:22] that's not part of our decision with [00:51:23] weapons that's not part of what we're [00:51:25] reviewing [00:51:26] but depending on what [00:51:28] our other responsibilities might be for [00:51:30] the common [00:51:31] people may expect us to be asking those [00:51:33] questions i don't know so so let's let's [00:51:36] talk about [00:51:37] the 1998 [00:51:39] quote that is with town council [00:51:42] so town council had rendered an opinion [00:51:44] on that piece of plan [00:51:46] we sent that meeting vote to them we [00:51:48] have not received the opinion we're [00:51:49] waiting on that opinion so we've already [00:51:51] we're proactively looking at that [00:51:53] terrific so we get that that's a concern [00:51:55] obviously it's a concern for us because [00:51:57] we have to understand [00:51:59] yes so we are looking at that [00:52:01] um [00:52:03] you know we certainly i'm not sure we [00:52:05] forwarded this to justin but [00:52:07] um or dpc we probably should [00:52:10] oh yeah so [00:52:12] justin i didn't know if he was verbally [00:52:14] talked to them or no i sent it and then [00:52:16] he called we have an email [00:52:23] okay so um [00:52:27] and and i will say this as i said to [00:52:29] other people sitting in the room put [00:52:32] your concerns down um [00:52:34] you know [00:52:36] understand [00:52:37] i don't take the situation you're [00:52:38] sitting in lightly [00:52:40] because i know the situation we're [00:52:41] sitting in and it [00:52:43] there is no good seat [00:52:45] just said it oh i totally got that [00:52:48] watching the meeting um the recorded [00:52:49] video from the last meeting the only [00:52:51] good seat to sit in maybe is [00:52:54] usda or somebody else it's not anybody [00:52:58] in this [00:52:59] um [00:53:01] and and [00:53:03] you know the intent is not to try to [00:53:06] what we've been tasked with where we are [00:53:08] at um and this is through conversations [00:53:10] that nicole has had recently with usda [00:53:13] our last meeting as a new site came up [00:53:16] and um [00:53:18] we explored that with usda and said [00:53:22] another site came up [00:53:24] what we hear is we cannot stop this [00:53:26] project from moving forward they're very [00:53:28] concerned that we're not going to make [00:53:29] the five year timeframe [00:53:31] we don't make the five year timeframe we [00:53:32] have a problem [00:53:34] and [00:53:35] if this project doesn't go well [00:53:38] the other two projects aren't happening [00:53:40] right and so understanding the funds we [00:53:42] understand the concerns [00:53:45] honestly if [00:53:47] my my thought would be let's find a [00:53:49] place that works for everybody [00:53:51] we can't do that [00:53:53] we've been told we've got to move [00:53:54] forward [00:53:55] so [00:53:56] not the ideal spot [00:53:58] understood [00:53:59] i get it nobody wants it in their [00:54:01] backyard i understand i wouldn't want it [00:54:03] in mine either so i understand [00:54:05] those are the those are the options we [00:54:07] were presented with we've been told by [00:54:09] usda we cannot ask for an extension for [00:54:11] another site [00:54:13] what was the other option [00:54:15] you said options [00:54:17] yes there are two options one was write [00:54:20] the original location [00:54:22] which we didn't own right on hardwood [00:54:25] roads right on harvard road so as i as i [00:54:28] uh looked through the bid plans and uh [00:54:32] have been reading the orders of [00:54:34] conditions [00:54:35] there was also an alternate that [00:54:40] states i believe [00:54:43] to upgrade the pumps at the school [00:54:46] so this would be alternate number two [00:54:49] having a pump station at or [00:54:52] near the coma [00:54:54] so [00:54:55] so is that according to the uh we're [00:54:57] talking about we're talking about [00:54:58] location now [00:55:00] we're talking about [00:55:02] is it necessary [00:55:04] we can't go there yes we can [00:55:06] we cannot [00:55:08] so so we cannot go there because usda [00:55:11] has told so the engineers have put [00:55:13] together the plan [00:55:15] usda engineers have reviewed the plan [00:55:17] for the current [00:55:19] whatever they've set out for the bid [00:55:21] package [00:55:23] whatever [00:55:24] plan is in place is what we have to go [00:55:26] with per usda [00:55:28] we cannot change the plan at this point [00:55:31] yes well [00:55:33] i think you could certainly modify it [00:55:35] and i don't think that [00:55:37] the engineering company is taken into [00:55:41] all considerations [00:55:43] for one now [00:55:45] i don't know i don't know if this is [00:55:48] possible or not but we have an emergency [00:55:50] generator that sits up [00:55:52] at the [00:55:53] highway mark [00:55:56] that and i know [00:55:58] could be wired to there [00:56:01] to whatever location on the common [00:56:05] as well as a remote power box now all of [00:56:08] a sudden the 12 by 16 [00:56:11] outhouse [00:56:12] is all of a sudden flush with the ground [00:56:15] because i'm not saying that this [00:56:18] is doable but has that been considered [00:56:22] honestly i don't know that's the [00:56:23] engineer's responsibility it's it's the [00:56:26] town's responsibility to have a [00:56:29] consultant [00:56:31] to discern [00:56:32] what this engineering company that the [00:56:35] town hired [00:56:36] is telling us is correct [00:56:39] so i'm not going to entertain this [00:56:41] discussion [00:56:42] tonight [00:56:43] this is understand your concern i [00:56:46] understand your concern we're here to [00:56:47] talk about the conservation commission's [00:56:50] concern okay [00:56:51] i [00:56:52] not discounting your concern [00:56:54] at all i hear it loud and clear we've [00:56:56] been down this road we were in no [00:56:59] certain terms told [00:57:01] at the townhouse by usda [00:57:04] it was came out of usda's mouth [00:57:08] they would not [00:57:10] allow an outside review of this [00:57:15] i'm not sure the exact terminology it [00:57:17] was asked by two or three people [00:57:19] and that's accepted by town council [00:57:23] we we [00:57:25] have tax dollars [00:57:27] we hold the loan [00:57:29] the usda is responsible for [00:57:32] the plants in the [00:57:34] the uh the water entering the ware river [00:57:38] and we don't have any say in what [00:57:41] happens in in the center of town we've [00:57:43] hired an engineering firm [00:57:45] yes usda has reviewed usda engineers [00:57:49] have reviewed provided oversight on this [00:57:52] engineering firm so usda is providing [00:57:55] usda will be providing you oversight on [00:57:58] this project [00:58:00] until our loan is repaid [00:58:03] is it a federal loan [00:58:06] yes it's usda money [00:58:08] yeah and so there's a loan there's a [00:58:11] grant [00:58:13] so the the loan is also federal money [00:58:16] yes [00:58:18] the usda funds are federal the state [00:58:21] grant is state money the five million [00:58:23] dollars [00:58:24] is state money and then [00:58:27] the other is ours [00:58:28] okay [00:58:30] we've already received the state money [00:58:31] that's actually sitting in the bank [00:58:32] waiting for this project to go it was a [00:58:34] requirement for us to get the usa [00:58:36] funding back is it required that uh they [00:58:39] take the uh [00:58:44] this has been over this moment because [00:58:46] he could come in and see me i have all [00:58:47] the answers [00:58:48] trust me i don't trust anybody i i'm [00:58:52] saying i'm saying trust me we are as [00:58:54] frustrated with this process as you are [00:58:58] we've spent a year trying to get this [00:59:00] money back for the town i you know it [00:59:02] doesn't matter you know i'll tell you [00:59:04] why this is my personal opinion [00:59:07] if the town doesn't do anything with the [00:59:09] wastewater we go bankrupt if we proceed [00:59:12] with what we're doing here from what i [00:59:14] can see what with numbers that are two [00:59:17] years old [00:59:19] i can expect that you [00:59:21] are going to have to come back to the [00:59:23] town at the end of this project and look [00:59:26] for upwards and i'm just guessing five [00:59:29] to eight million dollars and will be [00:59:31] bankrupt anyway [00:59:34] is that am i [00:59:35] i voiced that concern [00:59:38] very much so with usda they are well [00:59:40] aware of the increasing cost of [00:59:41] construction yeah very much and as an [00:59:44] installer of these projects i've [00:59:46] installed them i've done many of them [00:59:49] bigger than this one [00:59:51] this i [00:59:52] i cannot believe what i'm seeing it is [00:59:55] over built and not necessary [00:59:58] and nobody says anything about that this [01:00:01] is the usda [01:00:03] oh who who are they [01:00:05] i know they control the first strings [01:00:07] but they shouldn't control the common [01:00:10] especially the common that sat there for [01:00:12] 400 years [01:00:14] it's like putting an outhouse in front [01:00:16] of the lincoln memorial oh it has to go [01:00:18] there that's wrong [01:00:20] and i'm sorry [01:00:22] i don't buy it [01:00:24] there's something that is not right [01:00:26] would you like to sit in this seat no [01:00:29] then please understand i understand your [01:00:32] concern [01:00:33] we're not happy about it either [01:00:36] we have spent a year trying to get this [01:00:38] money back in years if this if we do not [01:00:42] get this money back in no uncertain [01:00:44] terms we were told by usta we cannot [01:00:46] modify the project [01:00:48] if we modify anything in the engineering [01:00:51] plan the project is done [01:00:54] it's that sounds it's done extortion [01:00:59] it's a condition it's a condition of the [01:01:01] project [01:01:03] well the condition of the project and [01:01:05] i'm only gonna it says [01:01:07] general conditions it refers to [01:01:11] and it's not deleted that i can see it [01:01:13] refers to the upgrade of the pumps [01:01:16] at the school and now i can assume that [01:01:19] those pumps are used [01:01:22] during and for construction to make sure [01:01:24] that that school is up and running [01:01:26] otherwise we'll have trucks running back [01:01:28] and forth correct so can i ask can i ask [01:01:31] you to do something i i will ask the [01:01:33] same my best of anybody else who's come [01:01:35] to me please put your concerns in [01:01:37] writing [01:01:38] please put your concerns in writing so [01:01:41] we can ask questions and get them [01:01:42] addressed [01:01:44] okay okay [01:01:46] it's nice that we have this conversation [01:01:48] i appreciate that you're here you're [01:01:50] experiencing the same level of [01:01:51] frustration that we've had this whole [01:01:53] project [01:01:55] but please put your concerns in writing [01:01:57] so we can try to address them we're not [01:01:58] trying to stick our head in the sand [01:02:00] when the additional site came up we went [01:02:03] back to the people who are involved in [01:02:05] the project and said there's another [01:02:07] potential site and what we heard is the [01:02:09] project cannot [01:02:12] be stalled it has to move forward if it [01:02:14] doesn't move forward our funding is gone [01:02:17] we still are in jeopardy of losing the [01:02:18] funding [01:02:20] we still are it's very clear in the loc [01:02:22] if you read it that we're in jeopardy so [01:02:24] please put your questions and writing to [01:02:26] us uh all right [01:02:28] other than that [01:02:29] i think so nothing can interrupt this at [01:02:33] all and we can dig up a dinosaur over [01:02:36] there oh that's fine we've got to still [01:02:38] put it in so i don't believe that so [01:02:41] the way we are approaching the product [01:02:42] now is we have to proceed with the dates [01:02:45] that are in the loc [01:02:47] there are going to be delays that come [01:02:48] up [01:02:49] i don't work in construction so i don't [01:02:51] know but other folks do understand that [01:02:53] delays are going to come we're going to [01:02:54] handle them one by one with usda when [01:02:56] they come up but we have got to show [01:02:59] forward progress with this project so [01:03:02] typically in a project this size [01:03:05] uh i would guess that there would be [01:03:08] between five and fifteen percent cost [01:03:10] overruns for un [01:03:12] uh unforeseen [01:03:15] hiccups [01:03:16] that's not uncommon [01:03:18] that money is on the top [01:03:22] uh also [01:03:24] the fact that the numbers are being used [01:03:26] here are a couple years old we all know [01:03:29] what the recession is [01:03:31] i also know that the mechanicals [01:03:35] in [01:03:36] the [01:03:37] project [01:03:38] are a [01:03:39] huge lead time and there will be some [01:03:42] delays i'm just telling him wait and usc [01:03:45] understands that but we we have to [01:03:46] continue to [01:03:48] we have to show good faith in moving [01:03:49] away [01:03:50] we're trying to be transparent on this [01:03:52] side and we're also trying to be very [01:03:54] transparent with um usda and let them [01:03:57] know you know how the project is [01:03:59] progressing we understand there's going [01:04:00] to be delays they understand too but [01:04:03] we're in communication moving forward [01:04:06] understand all of your concerns we've [01:04:07] talked about them [01:04:10] i can imagine if this project goes out [01:04:12] to bid [01:04:13] we we've as kelly said we voiced our [01:04:16] concern to usda usda knows that town [01:04:19] cannot afford an extra five to eight [01:04:21] million dollars on the back end very [01:04:23] clear [01:04:24] very clear we know everybody would vote [01:04:27] trust us we know that too we made it [01:04:29] very clear that it's a concern [01:04:32] it's been voiced to usda and what we [01:04:34] have heard is that [01:04:37] you know [01:04:38] they can't commit to anything formally [01:04:40] but they [01:04:41] trust me washington is washing watching [01:04:43] what's happening here this is a big [01:04:46] profile [01:04:47] project for usda [01:04:50] if it were me in usda shoes i'd want to [01:04:52] make sure that i was dotting my eyes and [01:04:54] crossing my teeth because this has been [01:04:56] and it's become higher profile because [01:04:58] of all of the media coverage of this [01:05:00] whether it's our own papers we're on [01:05:02] youtube talking about it now in our [01:05:04] meetings i can't imagine [01:05:06] that if we get to the end of the project [01:05:08] they're going to leave us holding them [01:05:10] back [01:05:15] let's hope eric i i don't i understand i [01:05:18] this is not why we're here to talk about [01:05:20] we're here to talk about conservation i [01:05:22] just want to make a statement okay put [01:05:24] my statement in writings i just want to [01:05:26] give you a heads up [01:05:28] the llc [01:05:30] uh to his point about the [01:05:32] pump station at eagle hill [01:05:34] there's nothing in this loc that talks [01:05:36] about a pump station [01:05:38] the verbiage under the under the uh [01:05:40] hardwood sewer system upgrade and pump [01:05:42] station [01:05:44] is all about this is two this is two [01:05:46] year old language right here [01:05:48] this is all about putting two new pumps [01:05:50] in up at the pump station [01:05:52] is that project one [01:05:54] so my question is i don't know why they [01:05:56] put that in here like this but the [01:05:58] problem is and i'm gonna i'll put it [01:06:00] down you can go right i asked you to put [01:06:02] it in writing i will but i'm just [01:06:04] alerting you that this is my question [01:06:06] really is more [01:06:08] obviously this is they didn't do their [01:06:10] what they were supposed to do when they [01:06:11] wrote this [01:06:12] the question is are they intending to [01:06:14] put [01:06:16] are they intending to do the upgrade to [01:06:17] the eagle pump station on top of [01:06:21] project one which is the plum station on [01:06:23] the comet and as it turns out the 3300 [01:06:26] feet of storm main that was never [01:06:28] discussed in one single open meeting [01:06:30] because i was at them all now i knew it [01:06:32] was there because it was part of the old [01:06:34] two-year-old four-faced thing but now [01:06:37] this is part of the plan [01:06:39] totalling over four million bucks [01:06:42] and in their in [01:06:44] their the cover sheet to the to the uh [01:06:48] bid package said that the estimated cost [01:06:50] was 1.8 million [01:06:52] how do you go from 1.8 to 4 million okay [01:06:54] i'll put it in writing so the so i will [01:06:55] say this the longer we don't get that [01:06:58] and i'm getting angry i'm getting [01:07:00] irritated and i'm not getting irritated [01:07:02] at you i'm not getting your i'm [01:07:03] irritated because we've talked about [01:07:05] this [01:07:05] we have never talked about the longer we [01:07:08] wait before addressing these issues [01:07:12] it's already been a few days since we've [01:07:14] had this conversation please get it to [01:07:16] me in writing so we can get it resolved [01:07:18] i just really like to get it to nicole [01:07:20] because [01:07:20] clarification we do [01:07:22] okay we can't answer it and unless we [01:07:24] have the specific concerns i just [01:07:26] figured this out like last night yeah [01:07:28] okay i've read this a dozen times when i [01:07:30] went back to it and i looked at it and i [01:07:32] said this makes no sense [01:07:34] there's nothing in here there are some [01:07:36] errors in there what there are some [01:07:38] errors in there well we need [01:07:39] clarification the errors [01:07:53] yes [01:07:54] we're not ignoring the question but we [01:07:57] need your specific concerns [01:07:59] you and we're not getting anything [01:08:01] accomplished here i got it when we keep [01:08:04] meeting this up [01:08:05] so if if the emails can go to nicole [01:08:08] nicole can get answers for you [01:08:11] please copy me right now but i'm sorry [01:08:14] the three of you plus nicole need to be [01:08:16] aware of what's going on [01:08:18] all right [01:08:19] so i'm going to send them out but i'm [01:08:20] seeing all of you guys absolutely [01:08:22] great yeah it's not a problem [01:08:24] yeah [01:08:25] honestly but it's hard to keep rehashing [01:08:28] it here and then we're not getting what [01:08:30] we need to get done [01:08:32] and there's more than the sewer project [01:08:34] that goes on in the town i know it [01:08:35] doesn't seem like that lately [01:08:37] but [01:08:38] nicole needs to be able to run her [01:08:40] office [01:08:41] and [01:08:41] everything else [01:08:42] it is you are right there is something [01:08:44] more than that [01:08:46] and if we're not wise [01:08:48] and careful [01:08:50] and have the right council [01:08:54] the towns will go backwards [01:08:56] and guess what [01:08:58] i can assure you that i am working [01:09:00] diligently [01:09:02] not talking about you no and i've worked [01:09:05] for the town [01:09:07] for years [01:09:08] there have been agencies working against [01:09:10] the town there have been agreements put [01:09:13] together that have zero zero positive [01:09:16] impact on the town i am never gonna let [01:09:18] that happen again i am working for the [01:09:20] town of hardwick as hard as i possibly [01:09:22] can for the whole of harwick for all of [01:09:25] hardwick not certain sections not [01:09:27] certain individuals but for the entire [01:09:30] town of hartford that's my job [01:09:32] you'll you won't see me in 40 years you [01:09:34] won't have any you won't have anything [01:09:36] i'm accusing you of anything [01:09:38] i'm saying [01:09:40] that [01:09:41] i think in my personal opinion that we [01:09:44] should have [01:09:45] some kind [01:09:46] of engineering [01:09:49] consult that reviews this and criticizes [01:09:53] it or says this is good or this is bad [01:09:57] and work directly for the town not for a [01:10:00] higher engineering company we hired them [01:10:04] so i understand that but their interest [01:10:07] is making money [01:10:09] and we know it's our money they use it's [01:10:11] public money too it's i it's rural [01:10:13] development it's i don't think that [01:10:15] they're malicious either i think that [01:10:18] people are um [01:10:20] you know close garden maybe [01:10:22] untrustworthy but i can assure you that [01:10:24] these are projects that happen all over [01:10:26] the country all the time [01:10:28] they're happening in other towns right [01:10:29] now this is a very normal thing to [01:10:32] upgrade your public utility [01:10:34] it's not a normal thing to [01:10:36] do it's not necessarily a normal thing [01:10:38] to have no money to put into it but it's [01:10:40] it is what it is that's where we're at [01:10:42] here [01:10:43] so i i'm sorry i'm sorry if i upset him [01:10:46] no [01:10:48] it's this has been [01:10:50] this has been four or five years of this [01:10:52] constant barraging so it's [01:10:55] it's [01:10:55] well [01:10:56] from my sitting here in this chair and [01:10:59] so what your experience is a little bit [01:11:01] little [01:11:02] a little bit of the wear down we have [01:11:05] been [01:11:07] i personally have been [01:11:09] under usda scrutiny [01:11:13] for a while [01:11:14] and because of wanting to make changes [01:11:17] at the board level so [01:11:19] what you're experiencing the frustration [01:11:20] is we sort of feel like [01:11:22] understand that you have concerns [01:11:24] understand that there's things that we [01:11:25] may need to revisit [01:11:27] but we can't do that unless we have [01:11:30] something to go to them with and say [01:11:32] look is this correct so eric's concerns [01:11:34] about the loi [01:11:36] put it in an email we'll we will go to [01:11:39] joe and say joe [01:11:40] what's up with this loi and go back to [01:11:43] dpc would they be [01:11:45] would they be receptive to [01:11:47] if someone came up with a [01:11:50] an idea that could possibly save the [01:11:53] town a couple million bucks [01:11:56] i can't speak for them and that's why we [01:11:59] went back to them after our last meeting [01:12:02] where an additional location was brought [01:12:03] up and said [01:12:05] would you potentially nicole you can you [01:12:08] spoke to them so you can say exactly [01:12:10] what we heard [01:12:12] they said we will never meet the [01:12:13] deadline this has been dragged on long [01:12:15] enough [01:12:16] um [01:12:18] it's [01:12:18] it's uh it's it's [01:12:21] very frustrating to the agency as well [01:12:24] because nobody has ever seen such [01:12:25] pushback for millions and millions of [01:12:27] free money and that they don't see [01:12:31] you know we can request it all we want [01:12:33] but they're going to deny it [01:12:36] and secondly they're going to say [01:12:38] you can't even meet your first deadline [01:12:39] or you actually want to go back again [01:12:42] after all of this i mean [01:12:44] i've only been here a year but i have [01:12:46] spent so much effort [01:12:48] to try to get this project back up off [01:12:50] the off the ground [01:12:52] and [01:12:53] they are [01:12:54] trusting that we are in a position that [01:12:56] we're going to be able to do it [01:12:58] and if we keep wish washing and going [01:13:00] back and forth [01:13:01] there is no doubt in my mind and i'm [01:13:03] going to tell you what i talked to you [01:13:05] today right i talked to bill today i was [01:13:07] in a meeting last week with six other [01:13:09] town administrators small town [01:13:10] administrator meeting [01:13:12] and i was telling them about my usda [01:13:15] money because you know the day we said [01:13:16] we got it all back it wasn't televised [01:13:19] so it's like nobody got to really [01:13:20] actually see that [01:13:22] and they were all like is that where it [01:13:24] is that's where it went because they're [01:13:26] getting denied left and right because [01:13:27] there's no money they know they're [01:13:29] getting denied no we're not giving it to [01:13:30] you i said yes 22 million dollars [01:13:34] and they're very impressed because [01:13:35] they're looking for six or seven and [01:13:37] they're being denied at this time not at [01:13:39] this time [01:13:40] so i think we're extremely lucky to have [01:13:42] what we have [01:13:44] and that [01:13:45] it's got to move forward it's part of [01:13:46] the public utility and if you maybe [01:13:48] people right now don't like it but in 10 [01:13:51] 20 30 years when julian kelly's [01:13:55] pictures are up on that wall over there [01:13:56] for thank you for all your public [01:13:57] service [01:13:58] we're to have a good utility thing where [01:14:00] people can flush the toilet and know [01:14:02] that it's going to go where it belongs [01:14:05] and that it's going to be treated where [01:14:06] the way it belongs the way it should be [01:14:08] because it hasn't been [01:14:10] for all these decades [01:14:13] it's a public utility that simply must [01:14:16] happen and you know i mean god forbid [01:14:19] god forbid i i really hope it didn't [01:14:21] happen but if the project ever went off [01:14:23] the rails in the indeed in usda [01:14:26] took the money away and then the state [01:14:28] comes in and they take over [01:14:30] and then [01:14:31] they're going to do that project but [01:14:33] they're not going to ask any questions [01:14:35] maybe they'll put it right in the center [01:14:37] of the comment i don't know i'm pretty [01:14:38] sure they put it right where it is [01:14:39] because the lowest part but they're not [01:14:41] going to ask they're not going to ask [01:14:42] what do you want it to look like do you [01:14:44] want it to look like an old building [01:14:45] like the rest of the common they're not [01:14:46] going to ask any of those questions [01:14:49] they're not they're just going to do it [01:14:50] the most economical [01:14:52] and [01:14:53] fastest way they can [01:14:56] the epa will in the state will do it [01:14:59] and it won't be done the way that we [01:15:00] want it so we were here to talk about [01:15:02] conservation's concerns um i sort of got [01:15:06] off track a little bit [01:15:08] again i would just reiterate if you have [01:15:10] concerns please send it in an email [01:15:12] we're not trying to stick our head in [01:15:13] the sand we are listening [01:15:15] um i will listen to anyone who has any [01:15:20] um [01:15:21] anything to say about this [01:15:24] certainly happy to have a conversation [01:15:26] or an email or whatever we get [01:15:28] everyone's concerns [01:15:30] loud and clear [01:15:31] just please give us something so that we [01:15:33] can follow up we're not trying to ignore [01:15:36] we're trying to move forward and you [01:15:39] know if you have concerns or questions [01:15:41] um i'd rather honestly i'd rather people [01:15:43] ask the question because i don't want to [01:15:45] get to the end [01:15:46] we're in this position [01:15:48] because of [01:15:49] what has happened before [01:15:51] lack perceived lack of transparency [01:15:54] perceived [01:15:55] it's not what we're trying to do [01:15:57] we're trying to move the project forward [01:15:59] not everyone's going to agree with it [01:16:01] and it's unfortunate it would be great [01:16:03] if we could put it in a perfect spot for [01:16:05] everybody [01:16:06] um [01:16:08] and [01:16:09] that's not where we're at unfortunately [01:16:11] yeah and this went out to council and to [01:16:13] the engineers today so he put it in [01:16:15] writing and we forwarded it along so we [01:16:17] can get all the answers yeah we thank [01:16:18] you for that um [01:16:21] you know so there [01:16:23] you've consulted them and they'll read [01:16:25] this and they'll see what it is that [01:16:26] we're looking for [01:16:29] the other aspect does seem to be in [01:16:31] motion we've been talking back and forth [01:16:33] with dep and now you have the engineers [01:16:35] talking to them to confirm and they're [01:16:37] going to withdraw and resubmit a new [01:16:39] notice of intent for this actual [01:16:41] attractive land [01:16:43] and it's not like it has to be immediate [01:16:45] you know don't feel like it has to be [01:16:47] you know done immediately we haven't we [01:16:49] have a few months so if you feel like [01:16:51] well i was feeling like holy crap we're [01:16:54] talking about october 1st and bids and [01:16:57] all this stuff and money [01:16:59] and i have to be honest i was thinking [01:17:01] like [01:17:02] whoa [01:17:03] this september meetings got a heck of a [01:17:05] lot of pressure on it [01:17:07] you know and i'm not looking forward to [01:17:09] that [01:17:10] you know i wasn't even looking forward [01:17:11] to writing this but i decided [01:17:14] you know what we're not going to wait [01:17:16] till the meeting [01:17:17] to explain you know whatever concerns [01:17:19] and problems we have we better get it [01:17:21] out now so that we can start looking at [01:17:23] it [01:17:24] absolutely yeah well that's what you [01:17:26] said before um so you know if town [01:17:29] console has this [01:17:31] the engineers you said you you forwarded [01:17:33] this to the engineers um [01:17:36] the only thing that's left a little bit [01:17:38] hanging is you know a lot of the things [01:17:40] that i was using as examples [01:17:43] you know about [01:17:44] the future and the potential threats to [01:17:46] the common or the stream right [01:17:49] do you think that the [01:17:51] you can have [01:17:53] i guess two thoughts i have one [01:17:55] can somebody probably the engineers look [01:17:58] at those concerns [01:18:00] and refer us to where there might be [01:18:02] some information [01:18:04] specific to this project where that's [01:18:07] been thought about i guess what i'm what [01:18:08] i'm wondering is [01:18:10] um you know if if what i'm hearing is [01:18:12] usga is actually reviewing a lot of [01:18:14] these plans and they're happy with them [01:18:17] so we should be happy with them well [01:18:18] that's fine but [01:18:20] um that doesn't help us see what they [01:18:22] were happy with it would be nice [01:18:25] just like you know we get um [01:18:27] whatever you know the drainage plan for [01:18:30] the solar site or whatever it might be [01:18:32] the engineering for the gravel pit [01:18:35] we get that stuff [01:18:36] i wonder if there's anything that usda [01:18:39] writes up for themselves that they've [01:18:41] reviewed a project and this is what they [01:18:43] look at and this is why they don't think [01:18:45] it's a problem for the community [01:18:49] it would help they will get these [01:18:51] answers for sure [01:18:53] stormwater drainage or whatever you know [01:18:55] especially like the the um [01:18:58] leaking you know i mean all of every [01:19:00] single every single uh [01:19:04] all of this stuff is in the ground and [01:19:05] it all it is for everyone every single [01:19:07] town right right so they do ensure that [01:19:10] that's not going to happen i think it's [01:19:12] encapsulated and encapsulated whatever [01:19:14] they'll get you those answers yeah sure [01:19:15] no question about i mean i'm sure we'll [01:19:17] get answers you know i mean a lot of us [01:19:19] suffer through the landfill days [01:19:21] and you know we were told things then [01:19:23] that a lot of us weren't too sure about [01:19:25] right you know trust us these things [01:19:26] never leak no problem [01:19:28] you you folks downstream with wells [01:19:30] don't worry about a thing this is state [01:19:32] of the art stuff and we're like [01:19:34] yeah not good enough so um [01:19:37] you know i mean we're asking questions [01:19:39] for the same reason that you guys have [01:19:40] asked questions all along you know [01:19:43] except we're coming in late because we [01:19:44] haven't been party to a lot of this and [01:19:46] we certainly haven't have been sitting [01:19:48] in you know i stated in here but we [01:19:50] haven't been sitting in mediation with [01:19:51] you so [01:19:52] you know now we're playing catch-up but [01:19:54] we've got a deadline staring at us you [01:19:56] know with a notice of intent and a [01:19:58] public hearing and all that kind of [01:19:59] thing so [01:20:00] we're trying to get that straight if [01:20:03] if um [01:20:04] if some of this stuff you know [01:20:06] there's a question right there is there [01:20:08] an operation and maintenance plan [01:20:10] how do we know on behalf of the town the [01:20:12] people that we somewhat represent here [01:20:15] from the point of view of the wetlands [01:20:17] and possibly even you know the [01:20:20] environmental integrity of the comet [01:20:24] how do we know [01:20:26] anything about the operation and [01:20:27] maintenance of this thing in the future [01:20:29] and [01:20:30] if it's going to be done in a way that [01:20:34] we don't need to worry about blow outs [01:20:36] leaks pumps going down [01:20:38] but we don't know anything about this [01:20:39] normally we would ask like we asked with [01:20:41] the solar project [01:20:43] what do we have for operation and [01:20:44] maintenance you know can we trust that [01:20:47] we're not going to have some kind of [01:20:48] environmental contamination over there [01:20:50] with the panels [01:20:52] if we don't have anything to read or [01:20:53] look at [01:20:54] or see you know an evaluation by a [01:20:57] third party or whoever then we don't [01:20:59] know anything [01:21:00] so that's all it comes from the [01:21:01] contractor that does the project they [01:21:04] have to provide that at the end of the [01:21:06] project [01:21:07] yeah well i know and i'm not telling you [01:21:09] guys anything because you're thinking [01:21:10] about this too [01:21:12] that's a lot of trust that you know once [01:21:14] it's built they're going to provide some [01:21:16] explanation and plans but it's in [01:21:19] and i'm just i'm talking from a [01:21:20] construction standpoint yeah this like [01:21:23] that's a requirement of our projects [01:21:24] when we do a project at the end of the [01:21:26] project we have to provide we don't get [01:21:28] paid unless we provide it right [01:21:31] provide what we're doing oh whatever [01:21:35] what part [01:21:36] all of it [01:21:37] especially known implants [01:21:40] i think what you're talking about is [01:21:42] what about the town's maintenance in the [01:21:45] future after it's done five years who's [01:21:47] going to run it so so if you read the [01:21:49] llc we're required to have an oversight [01:21:52] agency we cannot it is not just our [01:21:54] people running the system oh okay we [01:21:56] have to have an overview right so we [01:21:59] already budgeted budgeted for that this [01:22:02] fiscal year yeah well those are things [01:22:04] of course that we don't know about that [01:22:06] you know [01:22:08] we're just learning about it because [01:22:10] we're now being um pulled into the [01:22:12] project right it's our turn it has been [01:22:14] spoken about at several [01:22:16] different meetings right and i know it's [01:22:19] hot you can't make them all i get it i [01:22:20] mean [01:22:21] i don't want to make them all either but [01:22:23] yeah not only that there's a lot of [01:22:24] times if i come to a meeting i don't [01:22:26] absorb at all it's a lot it's a lot it's [01:22:28] a lot of information it is you know yep [01:22:31] so ask you what's it okay [01:22:33] um [01:22:35] so it would be interesting to see you [01:22:37] know if there is or will be parts of an [01:22:40] operation and maintenance plan [01:22:42] um or if there are some comments [01:22:44] relative to whether or not [01:22:46] you know what what what's the integrity [01:22:48] of such a thing [01:22:50] and do we have to worry about [01:22:51] contamination of streams or water or [01:22:53] wetlands or air or any of that stuff i [01:22:55] mean [01:22:56] you know i'm not telling you anything [01:22:57] that you [01:22:59] kind of don't know [01:23:02] so so i can tell you that a lot of the [01:23:04] things with the exception of the 1998 [01:23:06] document which [01:23:08] it's [01:23:09] you know sort of been brought up within [01:23:10] the last few weeks last month yeah um [01:23:14] you know a lot of these things have been [01:23:16] addressed or been discussed with the [01:23:17] engineers it's just you you haven't been [01:23:19] brought up to speed on them so i can [01:23:21] tell you that in mediation none of this [01:23:23] was discussed we were in mediation to [01:23:26] get the loc back that is it great and [01:23:29] that went on for a year and no one [01:23:31] crashed questions [01:23:33] and all of a sudden we're out of [01:23:34] mediation and now we've got pump [01:23:36] stations being ran down our throats so [01:23:38] the so the presumption that we're [01:23:40] somehow not paying attention to this for [01:23:42] a year is crazy because there was no way [01:23:45] for anybody to talk about it [01:23:47] now all of a sudden there's this huge [01:23:49] rush but no now we're starting to ask [01:23:50] questions understood and no one's [01:23:52] accusing you of not paying attention [01:23:54] we've been we focused our efforts for [01:23:56] that entire year trying to get this [01:23:58] money back we were very close we didn't [01:24:01] have the money and then once we emerged [01:24:03] from this loc we had these strict [01:24:06] deadlines where there wasn't a lot of [01:24:08] time for contemplation and thinking for [01:24:11] you guys to even you know pursue this or [01:24:13] look at it hard or find somebody else to [01:24:16] look at it which really is what should [01:24:18] have happened [01:24:19] but none of that could happen because of [01:24:20] usda's [01:24:22] timing on this [01:24:23] that's the problem [01:24:26] because of their deadline [01:24:29] there's a sunset clause [01:24:31] to all usda money and we are not going [01:24:33] to meet it if we don't [01:24:35] get going so they said get going that's [01:24:37] always been the case [01:24:39] unfortunately we wasted a year [01:24:41] right but was that our fault was that it [01:24:43] doesn't matter it doesn't matter eric i [01:24:45] understand that but for for them to do [01:24:47] all this demanding that you meet these [01:24:48] deadlines which are only forcing us to [01:24:51] spend way more money than we need to [01:24:53] those drawings that they've submitted [01:24:55] are ridiculous [01:24:57] there is more [01:24:59] cost in that system than you can [01:25:01] possibly imagine [01:25:02] and another question i would ask is what [01:25:04] if you what if it comes back the town [01:25:06] council says that that land is subject [01:25:08] to article 97 okay all right i'll do it [01:25:11] i'm just asking you right now what if it [01:25:13] comes back and then we got to deal with [01:25:15] it [01:25:16] okay but how long is that going to take [01:25:17] well if you moved it up the hill 300 [01:25:19] yards you wouldn't have 97 you wouldn't [01:25:22] have these guys you could start building [01:25:24] it [01:25:24] tomorrow so look at these three faces [01:25:26] right here we probably collectively have [01:25:29] slept less than you have worrying about [01:25:32] all of these issues why don't all four [01:25:33] of us walk into us or usda's door and [01:25:36] ask them directly why do we have to do [01:25:38] it this way we just need two more months [01:25:41] to move it up the hill [01:25:42] save all these issues we'd be further [01:25:45] along than we would we're not even half [01:25:47] the price or not even you get the door [01:25:49] and the door is gonna slam [01:25:51] i don't i don't necessarily [01:26:05] a question is that [01:26:06] what if it comes back that [01:26:09] that land that [01:26:11] is town land [01:26:14] where the bear is and the cattle ties [01:26:16] comes at that is not be able to be built [01:26:19] on [01:26:20] it's protected [01:26:22] what happens then [01:26:24] you're going to have to move the pump [01:26:25] station [01:26:26] i mean if town council comes back and [01:26:28] says [01:26:29] because [01:26:30] there's precedence and it's a town [01:26:32] meeting vote then you [01:26:34] you're going to have to come up with [01:26:35] another site but we don't have that [01:26:37] answer yet okay so [01:26:39] what what what do you think though if [01:26:41] they say no you can we have to proceed [01:26:44] so that's progress though [01:26:46] it's progress but we [01:26:48] we have to take that step initially okay [01:26:50] and that's what we're doing but it seems [01:26:52] like that [01:26:54] it just came out of mediation in june or [01:26:56] july whenever that a few months ago yes [01:26:59] so [01:27:00] this has been so rushed [01:27:02] in two months to say this is where it's [01:27:05] going you say oh we've had it all he's [01:27:06] like no it was just decided two weeks [01:27:09] ago that it was going to be put on the [01:27:11] common man you know was it going to be [01:27:13] across the street behind the historical [01:27:15] building [01:27:16] there was a very good option to move it [01:27:19] up the road [01:27:20] where it would be off the common and you [01:27:22] would satisfy almost everybody in town [01:27:25] nobody is happy about it being on the [01:27:28] common [01:27:29] nobody so so we do we do understand that [01:27:33] um [01:27:36] the sites were reviewed long before but [01:27:39] it wasn't brought to us [01:27:41] so it wasn't [01:27:43] it was the engineers [01:27:45] rob was involved in that there were [01:27:46] several people involved in site [01:27:48] identification well that wasn't it was a [01:27:50] gravity fed and now it's not gravity fed [01:27:52] so it doesn't have to be on the common [01:27:54] and if it's a pump station like it [01:27:56] doesn't it doesn't have to be in the [01:27:58] lowest spot [01:27:59] not an engineer i'm not either but [01:28:01] that's why not either okay so putting on [01:28:04] the comment is a travesty [01:28:06] i don't disagree becky the the usda knew [01:28:10] that they always wanted it there because [01:28:12] it takes more than two weeks to draw [01:28:14] these things they have just drawn up a [01:28:16] long time [01:28:19] that's [01:28:20] so we're going to go to town council [01:28:22] with this information [01:28:25] that information right [01:28:31] i can't stay up worrying about that [01:28:33] every night and you can't either until [01:28:35] we have an answer [01:28:36] i i understand that until we have i [01:28:38] think that's very important if it's a [01:28:39] vote of the town and if you're going to [01:28:41] overturn it that it should be going back [01:28:44] to town for a vote because [01:28:47] you know you just can't say oh we don't [01:28:49] we're just going to put it there anyway [01:28:52] we're gonna take directions [01:29:07] i don't mind just answering a question [01:29:10] if it's [01:29:11] we are at 8 10. right and going there [01:29:14] and asking you want to go out there and [01:29:15] yeah [01:29:18] yeah yeah we're fine with that and you [01:29:20] know what we're [01:29:21] we're not [01:29:23] we understand all sides of the equation [01:29:25] yes [01:29:30] it's clear to me [01:29:31] even from watching and listening at the [01:29:33] last minute [01:29:35] the august meeting [01:29:54] you want something from town council too [01:29:56] right [01:29:57] we are and we will keep you posted on [01:30:00] where this other stuff we're waiting for [01:30:02] for a legal opinion from town council [01:30:06] once we accept it we'll gladly share it [01:30:08] and then we have to make a decision how [01:30:10] to move forward at that point any if [01:30:11] anybody at the board end here has any [01:30:13] more questions about memos or if [01:30:15] anything it comes back as a question i [01:30:17] will say i'm going to reread it tomorrow [01:30:19] yeah well i mean even even if you get [01:30:21] questions back from top council or [01:30:23] engineers or whoever [01:30:24] you know feel free to call us absolutely [01:30:27] and thanks for taking the time thank you [01:30:28] and we understand this is very [01:30:31] controversial and exhausting [01:30:37] not sure if the landfill was you know [01:30:40] any easier or [01:30:41] i was there for that one and i don't [01:30:43] think so yeah yeah i don't think so at [01:30:45] all [01:30:47] thank you thank you thanks for coming in [01:30:49] on short term short notices [01:31:12] you told me that [01:31:25] she's just photocopying that for becky [01:31:29] it's really just [01:31:30] reports no no committee reports [01:31:33] haven't got our oil tank i saw that [01:31:36] that's great i did just read that in the [01:31:37] cold report yes so that's a positive [01:31:40] yeah excellent and rj mcdonald already [01:31:43] put oil in [01:31:44] good excellent and the fire escape [01:31:47] the fire escape uh we have to talk to [01:31:50] the architect that [01:31:52] took the pictures they are clear enough [01:31:55] for us to be able to determine [01:31:58] everything that he meant he wants okay [01:32:00] um but i don't think it can happen uh [01:32:05] before winter [01:32:07] yeah maybe because we have to come from [01:32:10] to you foreign for money yeah [01:32:13] um [01:32:14] but peter [01:32:16] is calling [01:32:17] schmidt he's an architect he's calling [01:32:19] me our good day okay so will you get [01:32:22] pricing for what it's gonna what it will [01:32:24] involve [01:32:25] and then come back to us well [01:32:27] i think we'll get one person's opinion [01:32:31] about what the price might be okay and [01:32:34] then um [01:32:36] talk to you about [01:32:38] where you would be looking for money [01:32:40] right as if it's going to a town meeting [01:32:42] that's way out yeah [01:32:44] um and [01:32:46] it depends on the amount of money [01:32:48] involved but [01:32:50] everything cost six thousand dollars [01:32:52] right [01:33:07] so do we need to submit something to you [01:33:10] so for our stipends do we need to submit [01:33:12] something for you or whatever no i'm [01:33:14] just going to go do what i what jen does [01:33:16] and it's quarterly social at the end of [01:33:18] september that's what i was going to [01:33:20] bring up tonight [01:33:25] so you'll just get them okay [01:33:27] in the mail [01:33:28] um so i signed this is there anything [01:33:30] else we need to sign oh no okay so onto [01:33:33] your report [01:33:34] okay so the usda update which will be on [01:33:38] every report going forward it'll be the [01:33:39] first thing we went out to bid for [01:33:41] project one on wednesday september 7th [01:33:43] we have approximately 10 bid requests [01:33:45] thus far [01:33:46] we have a pre-bid conference this [01:33:48] wednesday september 14th at 9 am at the [01:33:50] site [01:33:51] and dbc has submitted noi to [01:33:54] conservation commission on the town of [01:33:56] hardwood's behalf for the proposed pump [01:33:57] station the hearing was set for the [01:33:59] september meeting but due to the fact [01:34:01] that we're moving sites it'll be now at [01:34:03] the october meeting [01:34:05] so we wrote the retirement insurance [01:34:08] policy uh once it comes back from [01:34:10] council and i would like to get it on [01:34:12] the personnel committee and get it [01:34:14] finally approved for voter selectmen so [01:34:16] we can just get it [01:34:17] can we see that before oh yeah well i [01:34:20] would i mean i don't know about but if [01:34:22] the personnel committee is going to [01:34:24] approve it [01:34:25] then [01:34:26] we may want a little say in it just to [01:34:28] make sure well aren't you guys this [01:34:29] person look at you we are yeah that's [01:34:31] what i'm saying yeah like can we once i [01:34:33] get back from council then i'll send it [01:34:34] off to you guys [01:34:38] um dls department of local services [01:34:40] under the under the umbrella of the [01:34:42] department of revenue came out to do [01:34:44] interviews for a financial review we [01:34:46] haven't had one done formally since [01:34:48] 2011. [01:34:50] their initial impression was that they [01:34:52] feel optimistic on where the town is [01:34:53] headed and the accomplishments um the [01:34:56] formal review that they give to us after [01:34:58] we submit documents to them will take up [01:35:00] to 12 weeks they still have to talk to [01:35:02] the chair of the finance committee the [01:35:03] chair of the board selectmen and the [01:35:05] account and that is happening this week [01:35:08] um osrp update so open space and rec [01:35:10] plan update we need a planning committee [01:35:13] to work with cmrpc this is kind of like [01:35:15] fallen by the wayside it's not happening [01:35:16] until the fall anyway but um we do need [01:35:20] recruits if anybody would like to be on [01:35:22] the committee um this is gonna [01:35:24] allow us to [01:35:25] apply for grants for park and rec so [01:35:27] literally for [01:35:29] park equipment and things like that [01:35:33] um the town house [01:35:35] the fire escape inspector was conducted [01:35:37] and approved for the fair [01:35:40] but need some repairs than we are [01:35:41] looking into the boilers were installed [01:35:44] and inspected by r.j mcdonald on [01:35:45] september 8th and looked good and ready [01:35:47] to use for winter [01:35:49] you put oil in already oh it does stay [01:35:52] good okay [01:35:54] uh the fleet of computers and servers [01:35:55] are in cm geeks is working daily setting [01:35:57] up and installing new workstations we [01:35:59] are priority prioritizing the oldest to [01:36:01] newest staff seem incredibly happy to [01:36:04] have new fast computers [01:36:07] i had a legislative subcommittee on [01:36:09] september 8th we are currently [01:36:10] prioritizing goals and objectives to be [01:36:12] clear and concise when we present to our [01:36:14] legislators we are all in agreement that [01:36:15] our small towns are integral to the [01:36:17] commonwealth and maintain that we will [01:36:19] be a collective voice into our due [01:36:21] diligence receiving fair and equitable [01:36:23] services so it's the same complaint all [01:36:26] around [01:36:27] you know that none of us are getting [01:36:28] what we need [01:36:30] um [01:36:31] we're left behind on beacon hill anybody [01:36:33] west of worcester and so this isn't [01:36:36] something that's um [01:36:38] you know only for hardwick i mean i'm on [01:36:40] this committee that's for with a bunch [01:36:42] of towns so [01:36:43] we have that we're working on that and [01:36:45] then this friday i have a bylaw [01:36:46] committee so it's also through stam so i [01:36:49] have a committee meeting with my friday [01:36:52] um accountant shared services so [01:36:55] i [01:36:56] was looking into [01:36:58] the accountant right so we had looked at [01:37:00] it before we couldn't find an accountant [01:37:02] we ended up going with millions and it's [01:37:04] still been on really in the front burner [01:37:06] of my mind because [01:37:08] it's really hard having shared services [01:37:10] and not having an in-house account so i [01:37:13] was working with sherry patch from [01:37:15] princeton and cmrpc to develop shared [01:37:19] services [01:37:21] for two towns [01:37:22] so [01:37:25] we created a job description and [01:37:26] intermunicipal agreement and i talked [01:37:28] with dls when they were here about it [01:37:30] and he said absolutely we would suggest [01:37:32] that we would suggest that now however [01:37:35] will 16 to 20 hours be 20 hours each [01:37:38] week for for each town being adequate [01:37:41] so i did reach out to laurie uh delgio [01:37:44] to see [01:37:45] if she thinks that 16 to 20 hours is [01:37:48] dedicated right so this isn't this isn't [01:37:50] like working out for this town working [01:37:52] out for that town this is dedicated to [01:37:53] us and then dedicated to them and [01:37:55] clearly be available you know for [01:37:57] emergencies [01:37:59] and um so i haven't heard back yet i [01:38:01] actually didn't get a chance to call her [01:38:03] she [01:38:04] she uh [01:38:05] emailed me back but i didn't get a [01:38:06] chance to call her back so i wanted to [01:38:08] see what her [01:38:09] um impression is [01:38:11] but [01:38:12] you know here we are with shared [01:38:14] services all around the state that's all [01:38:15] they want to do it seems like they you [01:38:17] know they would rather just [01:38:22] throw [01:38:23] you know [01:38:23] two towns together [01:38:25] than really care about our individuals i [01:38:28] would be very concerned about 20 hours a [01:38:30] week um [01:38:32] so i don't even know that we get it now [01:38:34] um right just because of the project and [01:38:37] because of everything else and [01:38:39] trying to get you know everyone on track [01:38:42] in the financial department i think this [01:38:44] would concern me right now so the thing [01:38:46] is if we [01:38:48] our thought was that if we're going to [01:38:49] pay a good salary we're going to get a [01:38:51] heck of a good account [01:38:53] i mean i know i know some accountants [01:38:55] that would [01:38:57] probably be willing to leave their [01:38:58] single municipality for something for a [01:39:00] good salary [01:39:02] but that now i sent the ima over to um [01:39:06] dls because they want to look at it [01:39:08] there's a language that needs to be an [01:39:10] aisle ama so he asked me to send [01:39:12] actually i have to send all of them so [01:39:14] coa building inspector [01:39:16] um police they all have to go he said [01:39:19] there's some language through ethics [01:39:20] that i guess they're trying to fight but [01:39:22] they have to they have to be looked at [01:39:23] and have to be [01:39:24] integrated so [01:39:27] the next thing brings me to the [01:39:28] recycling the container contract [01:39:30] um i forgot to look at exactly when she [01:39:32] signed that but um our recycling [01:39:34] coordinator signed a contract with a [01:39:35] container company to rent a container [01:39:38] that our recycling goes in so it's not [01:39:42] the same company doesn't bring in your [01:39:43] container and take and um [01:39:47] take away your recycling so it was just [01:39:49] sitting there and then the recycling [01:39:51] whatever it is what you know waste [01:39:52] management whatever would come in dump [01:39:54] it put it back and leave so it was [01:39:57] getting very expensive because the [01:39:59] recycling company stopped coming so they [01:40:01] just stopped coming all together i don't [01:40:03] know what company it was [01:40:04] and so [01:40:05] their second quarter coordinator looked [01:40:07] around to get a you know to get another [01:40:09] recycling company to come in and found [01:40:12] somebody that actually leaves their [01:40:13] container there it's less money [01:40:15] and then they you know they pay [01:40:18] for the recycling [01:40:19] and [01:40:20] so she called the container company that [01:40:23] we're renting from [01:40:24] to come and have them taken away to [01:40:26] where he responded you have a five-year [01:40:28] contract you have four years left or [01:40:30] three and a half years left and uh the [01:40:32] only way to get out of it is to pay us [01:40:34] out [01:40:35] so then i responded and said that this [01:40:38] recycling coordinator does not have the [01:40:40] authority to sign [01:40:41] for any contract at all for the town and [01:40:44] therefore null and void with uh you know [01:40:47] the attorney our attorney our counsel [01:40:49] agreed [01:40:50] and supported that [01:40:51] and so then i got an email back from the [01:40:54] oh i don't know if it's the owner of the [01:40:56] company but contacted the company that [01:40:58] said [01:40:59] they don't care who signed it it's not [01:41:01] their job to know who signed it that [01:41:03] somebody signed it [01:41:04] to what our attorney said no it is their [01:41:06] job to know who can assign who can sign [01:41:08] it you can't just have anybody sign it [01:41:10] you know you've got to have the legal [01:41:11] authority sign it we you know so we can [01:41:13] go back and forth but you might want to [01:41:15] look at [01:41:16] trying to come to a conclusion mutually [01:41:20] and pay them out but not obviously what [01:41:22] we owe which is 9 [01:41:25] 400 [01:41:30] and this is why these department head [01:41:31] meetings are so important that so few [01:41:33] attend and [01:41:35] you know i've been very patient so far [01:41:37] that you know that people don't come and [01:41:39] it was supposed to be last week but i [01:41:40] did training so i had to make it for [01:41:41] tomorrow [01:41:42] but um [01:41:43] you know so so i can reiterate this to [01:41:46] people [01:41:46] that you know to find a date i'm [01:41:48] supposed to do one in september right [01:41:51] snacks with the selectmen or whatever [01:41:54] okay i'll reach out to you tomorrow [01:41:57] because i could reiterate the importance [01:42:00] of you know [01:42:01] well then everything has to go through [01:42:03] this office you know everything has to [01:42:05] go through this office and i mean it [01:42:06] comes down to even the fire department [01:42:07] as having an open house at some time i [01:42:10] don't know when or where [01:42:12] saturday but they didn't say a word to [01:42:14] anybody [01:42:15] you know it on the email i only saw it [01:42:18] on the email it would be nice to you [01:42:20] know a ask [01:42:22] b [01:42:22] let me know so i can help promote it [01:42:25] you know through our social media and [01:42:26] our website and our code red and [01:42:28] anything else that i can help with so [01:42:30] obviously we want participation there [01:42:32] but if nobody knows about it i reached [01:42:34] out to the chief and to like all the [01:42:36] emails that i have for fire [01:42:38] um asking for more details and if they [01:42:40] have a flyer i'd like to help promote it [01:42:42] and i i've heard nothing so [01:42:45] so next community compact cabinet do you [01:42:48] do [01:42:49] sorry so getting back to the recycling [01:42:50] yeah do you have the recommendation for [01:42:52] the board [01:42:53] what we should do [01:42:55] well [01:42:56] i [01:42:58] would like to talk to the attorney again [01:43:00] because i would like to see what they [01:43:02] think [01:43:03] it would cost them you know a ballpark [01:43:06] would be one thousand maybe six thousand [01:43:08] because then it would fight it a little [01:43:09] bit [01:43:11] or do i just go back to him so i didn't [01:43:14] reach out to greg or david or anybody [01:43:17] about that so i think that um i wanted [01:43:19] you to know right away that because it [01:43:21] was brought to mind it was just brought [01:43:23] to my attention too that this happened [01:43:25] and how important it is for people to [01:43:27] know that they cannot sign contracts at [01:43:29] all okay um so that'll be their next [01:43:32] next attempt yeah for sure and then i'll [01:43:34] have a recommendation from the attorneys [01:43:38] um [01:43:39] so the community compact cabinet grants [01:43:41] are open and i was [01:43:43] sitting with dls the other day and he [01:43:45] texted the person that is oversees the [01:43:47] whole thing and said you're absolutely [01:43:49] eligible there's a lot of money this [01:43:51] year you should go out for some grant so [01:43:53] i did start looking at that today and i [01:43:54] was like uh thought i was moving in one [01:43:57] direction and you know what happens day [01:43:58] to day you get pulled in another so um [01:44:00] i'm that's going to be coming up [01:44:03] november 10th i believe is the deadline [01:44:05] so i will be looking into them more [01:44:08] aggressively over the next couple of [01:44:09] weeks and let you know what happens at [01:44:11] the next meeting and then the water [01:44:13] commission you know we just had a [01:44:14] meeting at the townhouse we're looking [01:44:16] to upgrade the technology and [01:44:18] researching surrounding towns for rates [01:44:20] as well as exploring regulations and [01:44:22] procedures [01:44:24] i think we're a little bit lacked in [01:44:25] that department and you know as [01:44:27] important as that utility is i think [01:44:28] that we should really firm up some good [01:44:31] regulations and some rates and even like [01:44:34] we were talking about earlier potential [01:44:36] you know futuring of you know staggering [01:44:38] the rates throughout the years and just [01:44:40] knowing [01:44:41] that you know they'd be reviewed [01:44:42] annually what you know whatever they [01:44:44] have to do yeah and i just made two [01:44:46] cents on that like researching [01:44:48] surrounding towns [01:44:50] i i have a little bit of a problem with [01:44:51] that because [01:44:53] it's a town on a water supply where this [01:44:55] is 18 users on a water supply [01:44:59] why was ever done well we can't undo [01:45:01] that but [01:45:02] that being said [01:45:04] you know i don't think we can look at [01:45:05] say the town of where and what they [01:45:06] charge for water versus what you know [01:45:09] hybrid center is going to get charged [01:45:11] for water nope right right so absolutely [01:45:14] so we're looking obviously it's [01:45:15] disproportionate for a town i didn't [01:45:17] look at gilderfield there's nothing for [01:45:19] wheel right you know there's other [01:45:20] villages in other towns that have them [01:45:22] too right that specifically where i just [01:45:24] came from and then you know there's also [01:45:28] it comes down to most of them have a [01:45:29] certain amount of money a certain amount [01:45:31] of dollars right [01:45:32] for a thousand cubic feet or something [01:45:34] like that and here we are [01:45:37] we're we're measuring cubic feet of [01:45:39] billing no we're supposed to be [01:45:42] filling in gallons but we're billing the [01:45:44] gallon of rate [01:45:45] at a cubic foot which is seven and a [01:45:47] half gallons [01:45:49] so it's really convoluted and it really [01:45:52] just needs to be cleaned up so i'm [01:45:53] having angie help me with that and i [01:45:55] think that we'll have something good in [01:45:57] the next couple of months [01:45:58] and then obviously next [01:46:00] meeting i think i will probably ask for [01:46:03] the for the meters because i but i'm [01:46:05] going to get the updated yeah [01:46:07] and see if possibly the community [01:46:08] compact grant has anything i don't know [01:46:11] with that because that's something like [01:46:13] an ongoing public utility you're [01:46:15] supposed to be pa you're supposed to be [01:46:16] having control of you know so it's not [01:46:18] necessarily something like new or [01:46:21] innovative that you know but i don't [01:46:23] know maybe maybe i t grant i did that in [01:46:26] my other town for some licensing so [01:46:28] i'll look into that over the next [01:46:30] because that's it that's all i've got [01:46:34] good night kid night thanks ann motion [01:46:37] to adjourn for a second all in favor aye [01:46:41] 825