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These meeting notes are AI-generated and unofficial. They are provided for convenience and are not official Town records or approved municipal minutes. Verify all details using the source video and official Town documents.
The Hardwick Select Board convened to address several municipal matters, primarily focusing on a proposed policy for non-profit contributions to town services. Discussions highlighted concerns about the financial impact of tax-exempt properties and new developments on town resources, particularly schools, police, and fire. While licenses were approved and surplus equipment designated for auction, the majority of the meeting centered on the draft non-profit policy, its voluntary nature, and the challenge of quantifying both the costs incurred by the town and the intrinsic benefits provided by non-profits. The Board decided to hold a dedicated working meeting in January to further refine the policy, aiming for a framework that ensures cost recovery without unduly burdening non-profits, while also acknowledging existing pilot programs and the complexities of state-owned land.
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The pilot program and we also have a quick vote on some licenses and um yeah that's it so I would ask everybody to stand for the Pledge of Allegiance I pledge of aliance United States
Amer with liberty and justice all right thank you we are going to quickly vote on some licenses that still had needed inspections whatever yeah what if you want to
Call the order uh call me the order at 531 um and this me this meeting is also being recorded and is on um our YouTube channel too just so everyone's aware um so we finished up our
Application process um the building inspector police department and finance I mean sorry not Finance fire department has done all their inspections so I'm asking tonight that the select board renew uh the following licenses tons of stuff to sign um for common vict licenses the southberry rot and Gun Club
Hardwick Vineyard and Winery also their in holders license Eagle Hill Foundation Hardwick Rod and Gun Club dctf Corp the Old Furnace General Store Hardwick market and Package Store Mimi's Coffee House of Hardwick Hardwick Crossing Hardwick House of Pizza and the Whistle
Stop restaurant for common vular and for Class 2 and class three Auto renewals LNS used auto parts glesby Car Care One gagy garage LJ ay repair motor Specialties company Hardwick Auto
Sales regions repair l Associates um and there were two companies that did not renew this year um and those are Anderson Restorations and cler Classics because they didn't want to they were nonresponsive okay yeah
Okay asking uh the board to approve those following licenses I would move that we Grant the common Vic dealer's license together and in holder and class two and class three yes okay I'll second okay any other discussion all in favor
I do you want to sign them at the end sure okay yeah that's great thank you okay um really quick um this is we have a surplus equipment list in front of us that um went to auction the
Selectboard has to deem it as Surplus so that it can um just for U Pit Lake paperwork matter um if we could approve this list that Marty gave us for Surplus you going to read it sure 1998
Trackless mtst tractor trackless sweeper uh trackless tires and steel rims trackless snowblower Parts poly tailgate poly tank Meers sander 30C e yd Packer body 1988 Elgen
Pelican sweeper it's an 86 86 1986 Elgen Pelican sweeper 1999 Crown Vic police interceptor 2002 Dodge Ram 1500 pickup truck and a 1987 Ash Goos dumper sander
Combination I that we put these out for surplus auction second it any other discussion all those in favor I okay thanks now on
To get actually I have one oh you do okay so the copy that Justine just handed out to us is um you know Bill
Drafted this and then it went to Town Council Town Council made um notes on it and this is a combination of that so they their comments have been implemented into this new copy that
We're looking at tonight have you guys had a chance to go over it and as a board yeah no okay no
Do you have comments individually then well I guess we could probably start with I just want to get to see what some of the changes are so I have I have one that was sent out um couple weeks ago is
That that might be the same one so one of the changes is they wanted to Define what tax ined so on the on third page third paragraph down says this policy shall apply to all
Nonprofits that are classified ex as exempt from taxation under General law yeah looks like it's the same ver okay all right sorry I so F first of all question I have how
Many nonprofits are in Hardware 109 properties 109 properties exemp I do you want to see it there's actually I mean there's
152 but the town of Plick obviously is exempt so it brings it down to 109 properties okay does include state land M yeah so what are the top what are the top it's doublesided to just say is it like
At a top five of large nonprofits in town that would be the state but the state's not going to give us anything they do now they're not they're not going to fall into this policy I think well according to the policy way
It's written they are okay right yeah so we've got um' got the state has a bunch Eagle Hill has a bunch they are they are currently already into pilot programs with us now though okay
There you know the churches libraries common Land Trust um hyck area conservation trust I don't know that was the early name of the land trust oh okay yeah okay thank you and and just to make clear um Kelly
The state does pay us a it already corre and then the other the department of fisheries and wildlife comes in on the cherry sheet right that's so we get monies from the state both ways y okay just just to be clear that little bit of money the exact numbers if I recall
Right from this year were 94,000 for cherry sheet and what was it it was that was specifically from the state for the for the the pilot is like0 190 Al together um the pilot
Itself the Caron Reservoir is a pilot right that's 190 and then um then the cherry sheet was what 94 years said I think it is so the CH sheet is specifically the department of fisheries and wild that we
Get on the cherry sheet yes and the pilot is yeah DC DCR DCR yeah so the 109 properties how many of them are state is it quite a bit I I didn't do that count
I just took ours you could be great and is heagle Hill one property or is there
Main campus and then there's as is um like the land trust is multiple locations each location yeah is listed on the on the sheet so not all not all properties are going to are going to really provide are going to require services from us someone if
It's it's vacant land they don't necessarily need school police I guess it little fire than fire but that's what we've been working under since the master plan days we get that from American Farmland trust
Yeah it in the long term it saves the town money to keep the land undeveloped and we've talked with the assessors about that over the years and I I think that's true it's never been looked at carefully and that's one thing I'd like to see now is we do some kind of cost
Benefit analysis to see what the truth is well from my perspective um any piece of property in town that gets developed is is going to have a NE negative impact on the town Financial financially especially if you bring kids in so if you're going to collect call it
5 or $7,000 in taxes and you're paying out $20,000 per kid right there you're already in the hole so um one of the things that that worries me and this happened at a prior town is that somebody came in bought some property and then um came with a um a
40b housing devel that would have cost the town several million dollars in additional Services each year which would have bankrupt us um we want to prevent that the town end up having to pay them out and it cost them I think I paid I paid $800,000 for a land and we
Paid them we bought them out for $3 to $5 million Chris doesn't have to go through the planning board what's that doesn't have to go through the planning board not not 40 B if we don't have enough oh no it's 11% if we don't have enough uh inexpensive housing in town then we're open to this by law yeah up
To 11% I think is the 11 so um I'm just trying to understand the the policy here where you're looking at revenues so you're looking at businesses correct or profits that nonprofits that that generate Revenue
That's what this I read it was about 3 or 5% Revenue you wanted to M so it wouldn't so it really wouldn't pertain to vacant land if there's no Revenue being generated well nonprofits do take in
Revenue and it's tied to their 990 form okay that's what we there okay but like the this the com with the mask M How would how would we how would we go out to the state for for this policy that's we have to work on work on
Okay and and the state is addressing local follow that well yeah U just for the record approximately 12 square miles of this community is owned by the state of Massachusetts it's masswell white and thec DC DC 12 square miles out
42 subanal and there is a a push to get some kind of income for the towns that are around the Quin in terms of us protecting the water shed and that's an
Initiative that's coming out of the other side of the reservoir but um I think the small towns all around are starting to get into it yeah uh under the contribution structure you're looking for a uh contribution
Rate of 3 to 5% of both my copy just three the old just three and then one of the changes was
The catchup search charge instead of you know Going Back 40 years basically just go back to six [Applause] years and and would you apply the same logic to U
Churches to percent of their revenue Church helps the community and there's there's exemptions in here and they fall into the exemptions they fall into the exemptions
Where are the exemptions B is kind contributions and Community benefits article 6 so how how is that how is that going to be Quantified because quantify I'm the
Trable that would be up to the organization inst sty us okay so let's say example they give I don't know a thousand Community dos working around town doing stuff even at minimum wage $15 should do it ter
That's 15,000 so they can quantify a will inct but I me just to make it clear that you would consider churches to be part of this pilot program I do not the churches are not costing the or
Impacting this commun okay okay so it does have an impact on the community so they wouldn't be compelled to quantify their contribution to the community I I have a hard time I'm just going to interject because I feel like we're making personal exemptions for
What one person thinks might be make it exe exempt but maybe I don't feel that I think it needs to be a little bit more you know black and white not yeah I don't know I so I mean you mention mention how
Building and additional students well Eagle Hill builds housing and their tax exempt correct right now and that impact of their staff sending their students to our Public School cost us as a community yeah we pay for that yes so there should
Definitely be some so some reimbursement for that definitely anything that anything that's putting kids in the school should be we should be looking at pretty hard um because the cost of public education is so incredibly expensive expensive but they're in a pilot program right now to
Pay taxes on on the properties that came off the tax that came off the tax R they don't have to pay on that but they entered into a pilot program to do you know to do that well I'm just looking at this policy here how how it's How do we cover that that' be the
Biggest thing that I think we'd want to if there if there's a big impact on Town Services School mhm police fire anything else then you'd want to certainly want to cover some of that M or cover that cost right um but I don't see it spelled out in here to address that that's
All I think you'd have to we'd have to come up with a way to uh I mean the direct benefits if we're talking Eagle Hill Eagle Hill has contributed to the ambulance in days gone by and recently a big generator that lets us keep the fire
Department independent and never asked for anything I I look at things like they the one of the biggest employer they are probably the biggest employer in town too M I think those are things that you do have to you know take into consideration when we first talked about this we we
Mentioned that each you know any of these exempt you know Properties or you know Property Owners it would be you know it would be that we sit down and have a discussion with them it's it's voluntary to do this so
This policies voluntary or this is a policy this is a policy to set something in place so it blankets the town yeah okay and then we individually negotiate with say eagle Hill each Land Trust every individual nonprofit be have its own agreement right okay but it's
Voluntary it is they could refuse to they could refuse absolutely that's their choice y so this is more of a kind of outline of how you see it working and structuring it exactly but I I also think that Eric makes a good point about you know cost doing a you know cost
Analysis on what is it that that what is the impact yeah you know what is that number look like when it excuse me when it comes to you know whether it's the fire needing to respond or the or the police department needing to respond there post to the cost of a new of a
New family moving in with a couple of kids in school you know I mean we Jen and I have talked about this since a long time ago and 2005 but I've never se5 yes this was brought up a long time ago we've never and we got a pilot agreement with eagle
Hiller those days well we figured it I didn't see that agreement until 2014 okay I you know of an agreement there was a verbal agreement before that with PJ and Eric that they paid $25,000 a year and then it shifted to the properties going back on the on the tax
Roll per se correct please correct and it also excludes the campus and then correct okay well because they are tax exent organization well um so they pay on to they pay on the the properties that they own um that people live in
Correct no like the properties that are off the roles huh sorry I'm just what are you asking the the taxes that are paid on the properties it's the properties throughout town that you own you pay taxes on 10 individual homes and four separate Parcels of land thank you
Thank you and that's what was so that's the it's like a percentage of the actual real estate tax on those individual yep that's not fire pilot that is that is the basis that was signed in 2014 and
Then just last year they signed another pilot for the sewer the betterments on the sewer so if you sell a house then it comes off for tax RS just as if anybody else sells a house it's correct to the that point it be on the
Tax base tax RS right person bu back on correct correct how many students attend our school from you go I don't have that they don't that that like uh EMP like employees
Children's but yeah I don't I wouldn't have that I live on campus I don't know I don't have that I think if I there are three Stu there may be three students who are not in houses or other things that are paying taxes that are say in the dorm or on the actual campus that's not that wouldn't
Be part would be free so only three kids are attending the school no no there are more that attending the school but Others May Live in properties that are paying taxes to the town to be something that we rent or one of the taxes the houses that are covered in the pilot program but there are only three that
Are in on the correct okay that's correct that makes sense do we have a total number students could you get us a total number I can get it all right thank you so getting back to the policy um I think if we had a policy that would
Cover the cost the hard cost of the hard CA so school being one of them that can easily take kids we got them up multiply it by whatever that is because from I think from from a finance port's perspective is we're just trying to you know we're not trying to
Make money off this we just trying to cover our costs exactly and um and certainly with the in kind contributions that um like an needle Hill would offer us for you know whatever you know a generator or use of fields or anything
Else that that they would do um we've got to we've got to take that into account because it it adds a lot of value to the town to the town's people in the community which is very very important um and that should be weighed in in terms of you know there's going to be some cost but there's also some
Benefit that town gets as well that we probably will have to you we have to pay for um they let us use their facility for our trainings and stuff too okay that's great so I think a policy and and I find it hard you know being a being someone from the finance Community
Is you know I I've worked in nonprofit you take 3% of Revenue off a nonprofit and they they're not make they're they're out of business here's a question have you looked at their taxes who anybody's any nonprofit in town have you visited their 991 well I can tell
You right now from from a revenue standpoint they're not making 3 to 5% in net profit forms might say different okay so it's worth a look yeah I'm just saying from from you know ad joural business people you know businesses have to tax I know I know
Nonprofit tax but um you know they're not making not making 10 20 30% in profit profit so I think we just got to and this is a we got to look at this across the board get it if you've got something in particular that's that's I just don't
Think the town should be subsidizing these nonprofits it should be fair and reasonable yeah I think if you if they covered Services right then that's all we need and we have to look at what they bring into the town yeah I mean I'm a
Real fan of the land trust you know there people that come here and go biking and hiking and stuff benefit from the land trucks of course keeping the land open is I Believe In My Soul a benefit for the town so you know evil Hill does a lot of cultural stuff and I
Hardly ever go um I did with PJ have an agreement that if I had to move the quaba Estates people out because they're all electric down there almost brought them up into the into the dining hall you know for shelter cuz all those buildings are
Independent I don't have a memorandum of understanding right now but I can see myself looking for one so I'm talking emergency stuff so you know there are benefits to I mean there's different ways to look at it and it's going to be hard to come up with numbers but I think we should try to do that Adam chair
Agree can I say something I wasn't really going to talk but I guess I can never not talk um so when I first originally was approached with this I was under the impression that it was it so it's OB obviously we all know it's voluntary it was for you know new nonprofits or businesses that wanted to
Come into town and also looking at the ones that are already here but I I guess I didn't because it's a voluntary program and I think it's a good program I didn't necessarily think it needed to be I guess scrutinized to this level because I really thought because it's a voluntary program and we're putting a
Baseline in place um setting like you know up to five and like putting you know minimums in there I thought I thought this would have been a good thing overall not just to single out any one entity that's all I to say I mean we've spent a lot of time and effort on this and seems like nothing went into the
Previous Pilots like that just showed up got approved and that was it there was no input from the town There's No discussion there was no anything Council didn't even look at some of them sorry done talking well I this comes from not the whole board here though I'm not a
Fan of this and I haven't been involved in any of this so I mean I know it's gone off to council but I mean I I think we need to look at it really carefully when in here it says the town feels this and the town feels that I feel a little edgy with that I don't think we've voted on it yet
So no we haven't still up for a vote eventually we'll eventually get there it's a draft right so working draft how would it affect like someone taking aside the state and he's cor Land Trust in evil Hill like what is the harick historical society I mean
Have they would they have no Revenue no no not the town you know um although it's considered their own thing but priv but it's yeah um you know that's like the I mean is that cuz that's not the say that again gilafi Library that's not
All by time right it's not no you know the water departments are on this list as well and I mean I don't but so how do they get scrutinized for the other well that's just it like that's why I feel like we're being we're kind of like I feel like we're maybe targeting
Just specific ones and it has to be they all have to be looked at if we're going to do something like this and I don't think that we can you know says how you know what what is an exempt and then what are you know some some justifications for being exempt from this you know my view on that is going to
Be probably different than yours so how you know it's not black and white in here I I worry about that and it not being can they ever be dark and white I mean I'm just I'm just trying to make this black I don't have the I don't have all the answers that's for sure well at
The end of the day we just basically don't want a nonprofit costing the town and the taxpayers money agre period agre you carry your own it and we can we can analyze we can do whatever studies you like get all the police calls the fire calls the
Ambulance calls the Su all that and put a dollar to Donuts number on it well everybody can quantify it and get it yeah if we go back to the policy though the policy doesn't isn't doesn't read that way that's the point I'm trying to make like if if we could if we could get if we had a policy that we've got the
Town hall either through a reimbursement of money or a reimbursement through some sort of value ad M um I think we I think we'd all be fine with that but what this doesn't read this way that's that's the this is just looking for 3% yeah and then and I and I still it's it's still
In here I don't the catch-ups are charge I I I have a hard time with that because these are nonprofits and now you're looking to to go back um 6 years I mean that could really that could that could really put I think a a heartache on on anyone you
Know the my concern is the Optics and there are there are certain organizations that that make a impact on the town's expenses but many of these on this list don't so how do you distinguish between is it just better to just pick up the phone and start a conversation with some of
These people that you think especially if we can as a community come up with a cost of what it what they cost us to operate in this community and that way the Optics are a lot better that we're looking at it not at the not at these 3% of the St alicious church as an example
That they don't have 3% they don't and the Optics would be you picking L churches for I mean that that's exactly what I read here is you know you it's not black and white enough so that you can draw your own own conclusion on what where
You apply it I don't think it's a bad idea they just it's a great idea but how do you how do you make it black and white so the Optics aren't so so I would say irritated because it does look like that to me in some cases I could think half dozen examples
Where it's foolish to even ask they don't disagree can we somehow get at this set up a a working group some kind of is that what this is MHM that's what this is so I know so we have to compile facts
And figures and trying to keep it off you dear you know you're sweet yeah the biggest impact of course is going to be the school so you know but we could take it we could take it down another road it could be number of students number of ambulance calls number of police calls
Number of fire calls I mean you could just look at that and say where is it costing us yeah and then make that pick up the phone yeah say you you uh you we had 15 ambulance calls to your organization
In this period of time yeah you know that's the kind of quantitative basis that you probably want to take a look at yeah yeah have it be something that you're it's an manual review or you're looking at it over a certain period of time and it's negotiable for revisiting
So if at some point they're putting a lot of having taking a lot of resources but then something changes and they're not then right you don't want to make them have them pay for something that they're not it's not cosing the town I mean you could take it the extreme of course is you're
Plowing the street in front of this place you want to take that I mean there's certain things that you just just take for granted that you're going to take care of road because they're open to the public well and I think there's also I mean I I think there's also something to be said about being a
Good neighbor too um you know if if if any of these entities like I said employ the the people in town or I you know I I just yeah I don't know I just have a hard time
Making it kind of very boil up plate what do you want to do I kind of like the there's a scale of some sort don't know like you
Say do you account the ambulances do you count the students and and that's that's where you start your negotiation and say yeah okay we do this we do this but also we provide to the town a place for for a you know all these things that may be a
Town benefit that have a monetary value to them um you know the church has the food pantry in it you um so it could be some intrin value to you have to take into account too I don't think you can quantify what a church does I mean it's
Pretty difficult to put a value on that no but it's it's a community service that is provided that has some intrinsic you know value as does Eagle Hill as does East quad landfest I mean and it's hard to measure enjoyment on a trail it's hard to
Measure um the education kids that are going to grow up and maybe do wonderful things in this world you know I mean that that that's their job is to is to educate what do you think the U property owner of 12 square miles of
This community is going to tell you when you say give us your your value that you you bring to the community I mean there yeah they're the biggest violator I mean of the who mean St State absolutely and and their amount of money we've been
Trying to fight that fight for a long time now unfortunately um you know we do get you know obviously we do get some money but um you know maybe not to the yeah 12 s miles right but as as the policy is written they wouldn't pay us anything it's voluntary because there's
No Revenue not generating Revenue we already get but there's the the cherry sheet in the and the pilot from the state is pretty well documented yeah but this says 3% of your Revenue but the state isn't right they're not generating revenue for having conservation land correct yeah so
They wouldn't yeah would even right it would fall out of it well the charge for the water yes so then we'd have to take a piece of the surrounding land all the way around for the water shed would get complicated yeah well that's what they try to do trying to come up with some kind of
Justification for that and should the local town the surrounding towns around thead that's where politicians come into play we can we've had meetings with them too yeah they've been they've been present at those meetings I will say they've been very present
So so to answer your your question about do we work on this I think we start with we I think payment in lower taxes would to cover cover the cost of the services we provide that would be reasonable and fair I think um and and we can look at
It through either um you know some sort of contribution but they contribute to the town or they contribute to it financially and at least that gets us whole that's all we're looking to try to do yeah this isn't a profit Center for us but you're not suggesting that we charge a fee for the ambulance showing
Up no because we don't we don't have an we're paying for paying for ambulance that trust me we're paying for right out what budget budget it's in the budg buget oh it's in the budget Barry and Westbrook field we pay each one of them 100,000 maybe no 25 to
One and 35 to the other or 28 and 25 or it's 60,000 in the budget for oh is that the Emergency Services correct yeah okay yeah yeah okay you don't want to get into that habit though of charging no you kind of look at what do you no but you look at what you know like the cost of it per se you know and um it's not
Free no it's not free but try to put a value to it um something that's fair for both both parties and I think I think I would imagine that non the nonprofits that that are using the services would would be open to how do we to be good good citizens
And again to be good neighbors neighbors right how do we make this so it's not a burden right right I mean that was the initial you know I think that was your that was why you proposed it m to to we shouldn't be subsidizing to be and to but to work together yeah to you know to
Find that Common Ground yeah well what's our next step then any suggestion go to the fire department and get a list of
Calls well I think we got to we to start with this first it's it's very much written as you know the contribution structure
Is pretty this is what it's going to do mhm where I think it's on a on a Case by case basis and ultimately the contribution structure is going to be we would we would expect and want to
Work with you to cover the cost of the town's not out of out of Po actual like cost that yeah rather not a percentage and then and then you know have a structure where we're we're we're revisiting this on a on a more frequent
Basis because that cost truck could change um and that way they everyone an annual review yeah and everyone's getting a fair shot of you know I mean we do that when we when we partner up with other communities for intermunicipal agreements they're looked at annually to see you know what were're
Like say the senior center M you know it's looked at annually to see how many of our residents Go versus theirs and can we pay based on that listed under section four provid an annual report on their usage of town services to support pilot TPC okay
Great we should think about a way to I don't know how to do this but try to put a a value on the ephemeral stuff the the joy of the beautiful land things
That don't have a dollar value per se or in the church you know the the feeling of community community building and all the other stuff that it's all it's what we all want it's what the town is known for but we don't have a way to put a dollar
On it that probably it's impossible but I'm just curious because you know I'm listening to this I'm saying is there a KN for profit that you would like to have come to your town could you think of one Doctors Without or a n but I'm saying I guess
What I'm saying is you never given is your is your policy is your policy looked at as anti not for profit I mean you don't have any control over somebody that comes into town and buys something because they're are not for profit there's no control so the
Question becomes does this become something that's encouraging or discouraging from that very flexible and reasonable I did I'm I'm asking the crowd I'm giving you my input I don't have the answer to that I'm just making that observation For
Thought yeah medical nonprofit which we want to attract whether they would be that's a good one yeah yeah yeah you get the prize an thank
You yeah I think I I just I said I have a couple of concerns um but I do think that it's a I I don't think it's a bad idea to have one in place I just think that it
Needs to be you know this this could be used as a if written carefully not that it isn't as a tool to encourage you to pick up the phone and have that conversation
Instead of mandating that how many times did the ambulance show up it's your place I think our ambulance crew knows that and how many times did the police show up I think they know that and the fire department knows that so we would know that answer we don't need to put that unnecessary burden on somebody else
To tell us that but to me this document could force both parties to sit down and make make some Headway but I'm again I'm not sure this document in total is 100% what we want to do
My my opinion is you pick up the phone somebody and say if you don't want this let's get let's start talking because this puts an undue burden on a lot of people to try to make that to follow that rule yeah and if it's all voluntary we could just
Say I don't want to talk to you did you want to say something yeah I think because boards change Administration change and I I think having you know something down on paper that's harder to change I think that's probably a good idea because like I said wordss change
People you know people change administrations change um that's nothing wrong with boards changing and administration's changing it happens every day in government oh no that's not what I meant yeah what do you mean then I just to have to have the policy CH but then every time a new board comes in
They can vote this out right you can't this you just make this for your board next election could be back in or back out you can get a majority that's right so so does it do you any good well needs change in circumstances yeah everybody you know there's there's something that drives a certain agenda and that agenda
Changes every Administration change very true I think if we if it's a financial policy the town adopts that we're trying to not that we want to make should we cover the costs M um that is just a
General Financial policy then you know it's a Guiding Light that we as a town will try to follow and then the policy can the specifics of it can can change here and there but ultimately we're just trying to you know how do we cover our costs provide great services and cover
The cost you know in MO taxes you said it better than me that's all I was trying to say okay and then each board can as they change you know we'll make a lot of money lawyers yeah that's what's going to
Happen because there's too many too many black and not black and white aspects of this thing it it could be it could be two sentences that exactly that's all it that's what it needs to be needs to be it needs to be a document that drives you
In 2005 if it only needed to be two sentences I moved in three years ago I have no idea yeah me either okay but we're here tonight right and you put this simp you put this forward which was a great start so we have a working meeting let's talk through what we need to do
Yeah Solutions yeah will it mean that you have to have a um conversation with everybody on that list call them up and say hey we have a new policy we want you to you know the church the library and say here's our
New rules and they would come and sit with you and negotiate a pilot is that kind of the that's the place well they're not they not it's new policy not a new rule because you can it's voluntary right I mean it's not voluntary they they will get called in
To to say there's and the process that it was mentioned that emergency services police and stuff were getting build bills were going out to these nonprofits after three calls and that hasn't been the case there was no
Billing so there is cost involved in all of these yeah and that wasn't happening for whatever reason it did happen in the past it has happened in the past well it's not happening currently correct no you how long we don't know 25s my smoke detector went off too
Many times or something call the hardw fire department coming and checking your no they thought there was a fire they showed up they charged after the third one there you go is that recently um it's I yeah I haven't worked
Here that long either so you fixed the smoke detector I fixed the fire that making the smoke that set off the smoke the fireplace all right so okay open the flu
Yeaha wasn't that but it does sound like they have to have the invitation for the conversation that's all you're really looking for is to say we'd like to we'd like to start from scratch but I wish is what when you're going to
Call up the hard Historical Society they're going to say sorry we have no money right the church will say you can't enter it I know it's voluntary right and on and on on I don't know you know the the land trust is it how do you is that update
You said Revenue that's based on money they take in as contributions that's not really Revenue that's it's consider contributions grants stuff like what what would what would their what would the um Demand on the town will I will
What's the demand Demand on the town Services they probably get about 10 calls a year for for lost people on turs okay but but why why would that be the the Land Trust issue versus well they're
Supposed to maintain their trails and maintain the property and have it properly marked so people don't get lost so why should it be the citizens paying for those Emergency Services you know what I mean it's this balance yeah I know people get lost get lost in own yard walking around
Some going in the woods did you hear about that um I don't want to entertain a ton of questions but I I see that your hand was up Bill well I'm trying to stay positive I was a little disappointed that we didn't have the most current material but I
Think it I think it was there are there are I think everyone has I only have the old stuff the our commission wasn't sent new I think it I just looked at a version that he had and there are things in it that are oh it's different okay I apologize
Well anyway Kelly that wasn't really my point my point was trying to stay positive um in relation to um Mr bhim's comment um and through the discussion we're hearing you know we've tried to insert ourselves at times um it's extremely important to acknowledge that there are plenty of studies and surveys
That document the economic benefit to communities local communities of open space lands Trail networks recreational access and to be honest I've worked for the federal government and the state government and I I don't appreciate hearing that you know State ownership
Would be considered violators when you know they host Hunting Fishing hiking bird watching any number of things and the people that come to enjoy that stuff they benefit from our investment including Town investment we just spent several years improving some trails to
Attract people and people are using them the land trust spends plenty of effort and money their stewardship Committee in maintaining a trail Network that people enjoy and come here for these things result in economic benefits to the town so my
Recommendation is those things be evaluated at the same time that service requirements are being evaluated and that's what we were saying is time because it wouldn't feel Fair other to put I don't know the I don't know how you could put a dollar amount on but it has to be considered there are studies
That estimate for Rural communities in different places what what general numbers for those kinds of things and money spent in the area buying food right because when people come in then they're exactly buying gas buying food recreating you know um whatever I mean we even partnered with Mary Lan hospital
For God's sake for the Fitness trail so there are benefits there are health benefits things like that we can try to look for some estimates of things like that um if we're going to try to evaluate costs in terms of services we should balance those against benefits because there are economic
Benefits yeah no agreed I think I think that's what we're all kind of saying here is that all that has to be taken into consideration when you know having conversations with with these entities for sure yeah bill in in the word intrinsic value is probably which you
Can't measure right is probably the biggest one that you know in some cases like you're you're citing as an example of reasons why you would welcome something like this into the community yeah I was just trying that's why I was asking you know could you think of something that youd like to have that's
Not for profit in this community there are examples yeah well land trust is one of them it's hard to convert into dollars and cents right you know but that's what I'm trying to get at that there are some estimates for dollars and cents we just have to I just have to go find them or
We have to find them um you know that's not counting the um whatever intrinsic values of open space to the people that live here and the other you know citizens of the Commonwealth that want to come and visit here because of the vistas and Views and all that you
Know good points well for every subdivision that doesn't get put in because you've now protected that land you just saved the town right exactly millions of dollars worth that's what the cost of community the cost of community services studies all show that and we have four towns that
Have been done repetitively in Massachusetts the latest was not 2019 I brought copies if you guys want those cost Community Services study show I would take a copy of that I would be interested yeah I've handed those out before but I I was happy to reprint a bunch of these things just so the board
Could spread them around and we have them electronically this proves that you know industrial lands and Commercial lands pay their way because they bring in more in taxes than are paid out in services but residential lands cost more in services to the town
As you pointed out than they will ever bring in in services so you could almost you could view conserving some lands at least in key locations as avoiding more expense to the town it is we're at 33% owned by profit in this
Time if if you include state if you want to talk the land trust you're talking three saying it's a pretty big number it is just so you're aware of it it is I'm pretty aware of it but we also have clean water 8,000 Acres 8,000 Acres 12 square miles God
Bless them they need water yeah because of that we're custodians of the water supply for all of eastern Mass and we should get some credit and economic benefit from that and I know certain senators are proposing that and we should all support and push hard for we need to push hard we Steward their
Water we don't have to be so good about it you know you can't pick up the phone and ask them to think better going to no incentive no incentive our legisl I'm not sure what it is but we can do that too okay okay so
I don't have all the answers for this tonight but do you want to make some it's it's two two sentences we'll make we'll we can run it up pretty quick okay where where did you find a magic hat start all this I can I mean we'll
Have I mean let's see what they come up with to you know to to add to it maybe you know yeah let's come back at it with some different ideas some new ideas and you know and again don't this isn't a bad idea I just has to be I do see you
Eric hold on um I just think that we have to um I don't know I just let's get some other ideas and boil it down and see what we come up with have another work session is there something you can just do we can distribute our comments to re okay with
That yep as long as no one's responding and having a conversation about it back and forth if you want me to compile them I wouldn't mind doing that either all you maybe do that and then and then Jus can send send it out to all of us Eric so the planning board passes a
Bylaw it's enforced by the zoning enforcement officer you guys write a general bylaw it's enforced by you through the police department this policy is voluntary there's no enforcement I don't understand why you would go through the process and
Spending time and legal money counts paying for legal to review this for a policy that you can't enforce what happens when the two biggest nonprofits you're talking about say thank you but I'm not involved have a nice
Day it's it's to me it's silly to pass a rule that you can't St well if it's a financial policy I like that idea it's just a guideline right a guideline for what for I the problem is and I can't speak for
The school or the land trust but if I were them and I would say well wait a minute I don't have to do this thank you I'm not going to be involved so then what well I mean eil is already doing well they are so they are you know like and yeah honestly I don't think they get
Enough credit for all the other things that they do but then they're forced into saying well we're not going to be involved so then what's the image of that but they're already doing two pilots that know right but I do feel sorry no I I do feel to a certain extent and based on some of the comments made
By by you in particular this evening that you really are looking at Eagle Hill and its use of of services and and I think that if you were to set a policy like this we're not going to be a the one that you are proposing we are not going to be able to pay and we won't and so then what happens is is we will
Become villainized in the eyes of the town because we won't be be meeting the need and we we've all experienced it we've all seen it most people probably don't know that we pay two pilots right now most people probably don't know that we probably pay more taxes than anybody
Else in town right nobody knows that we forgave nearly $500,000 in the loan when it came to the sore people don't know those things so if we were to come up with a new policy that essentially negates the existing policies and we can't meet the guideline that you set
Then it's going to be Eagle Hill hasn't done what it needs for the town which is why I think that working with it the the the entities individually is one way of going about it um but I I guess in my in my view this wouldn't even apply to you because you're already into pilot programs and
You already have done the like you just said you know the the Forgiveness of the money and when it came down to the sore I I I don't look at this being something that you would even have to do in my opinion right because as you're already in a pilot well and I would hope that
When we enter my hope also is that when we enter in these agreements that that that there's value to those agreements right that it's not just just for the time period in which it's convenient but that we've done it all in good faith and we've entered it not that okay now this one doesn't work so we're
Not going to do this one anymore you know but I I I appreciate what you're saying Kelly and I and I I believe what you're saying but I don't think that that's the intent of the whole world I think the nonprofit should cover their cost if you're burden on the town well I don't view Eagle Hill school as a
Burden on this town if you look at the number of students that you send to our public school and just do the math on that we run a negative on this town and most of those students live in houses that are having taxes paid on them you can also look you can also look at the students that are here in town that go
To eag there there's a perfect example where Eagle Hill is burden on this town you get us the number we'll sit down we'll talk and and also being a charitable organization you're not supposed to be a third Community you're supposed to run an
Organization and you're supposed to know and work with the community don't be a bur on the community we absolutely work with the community well we there's a list of things that they've all mentioned that we do just saying well let's start with the students it's not my opinion it's
Numbers it's numbers number of students going to public school at roughly 20 grand ahead just numbers okay and then you'll have to deduct all the value that we do bring all the jobs all all the businesses that get visited by the people we bring in
All the programming everything else that gets done okay respond Eric Eric I think the the policy is really for to have a policy in place so a new if if a new nonprofit came in it would be a
Guideline of this is what we're trying to do in terms of meeting the obligation of what your services are not you know the existing is the existing he's been going on for I mean the policy would hopefully apply to it but I think from our standpoint having something a financial policy in place that would
Cover anything new at least at least you got something you can you can go on from a foundation to work with yeah yeah well like kind of get it but it's still voluntary it is voluntary and you know again to me it's all about enforcement M right the bylaws you can enforce those this you can't yeah and I just don't see
The ex going through this exercise if at the end of the day there's they don't have to deal with it you don't have to comply with it and I just find that sort of silly to go through that too I mean I think you could do do it other ways I mean I would
Ask has the board ever approached the school about any of these issues within the past 5 years well I think this is an eagle Hill issue it's I'm just we're just talking about a finance policy that would be right yeah I don't think I don't think any one entity should be should be you
Know yeah thank you thank my words just weren coming you know it shouldn't that shouldn't be the case if we get into an Enforcement issue we've lost it right that's not where we need to go right correct it's not where we can afford to go just here a community work it together I think that
There are policies in place in in other towns and I think that the entities they decide what of sort of what they're able to pay of of what they've been requested you know I would ask I would suggest that you might even look at the city of Boston and what they've done with a lot of the
Universities and and places that are in the city of Boston they they have what is nationally sort of heralded as a as a solid program um where and it it it takes into account what those entities how they benefit the city of Boston
And not all you know Harvard University is paying 75% of what's being requested not there you know they're not all meeting the requests but if you're looking just for a a a guideline or a policy I mean that's something you may want to investigate what they
Do okay um well do we all want to get our thoughts to Justine have them recirculated and do another working meeting in January
A deep cleaning that I just set up well I just it should be maybe not not a regular meeting I just assume it be another meeting where we can just discuss you know yeah any any other towns programs I mean like
De yeah you he but are any of them based on a percentage of Revenue or are they pilot negoti Reven twist okay that's all well I think that's what everyone's having the hardest time with so maybe if we can really look at that
And you know just do some other things tax exempt they property tax exempt so our meetings would be the 13th and
27 correct sorry what we that's okay our meetings the 13th and the 27th okay the 13th is already getting pretty full just yeah no I don't want it to be on a regular meeting night what about Tuesday the
7th no not here Tuesday the 14th not here
I can't do the six the 20th is Martin Luther King day we can't it's a holiday I already looked at that one yeah the 21st I I'm open on the 21st but Chris are you back yeah I can do the 14th and I can do this we can do the 14th or the
21st yeah what's I can do either this is January by yeah do you want to do the 21st so it's not two meetings in a row sure um so are people going to send me their comments and then I'll compile them yes and ship them out yes can can
You post my meeting too yeah I'll post your meeting do you want to do 5:30 again does that work for everybody are you going to start having regular meetings we thinking about
It um but just really quick before before we adjourn I just want Justin to bring up so that everyone's aware that we are likely going to owe
Zikos for not doing the auction for cost incurred plus 12% um pretty much that's it so whatever the board wants to decide moving forward I didn't have the numbers at the last meeting so I kept my mouth shut but if the board does choose to go
In a different direction or do nothing what is was supposed to cost the town nothing is is going to end up costing us whatever they've spent thus far are plus 12% uh and I don't know if that includes timeing time you don't have a number on that I don't know I haven't talked to them I was waiting to talk to
You guys yeah have they stopped incurring costs they haven't heard from me at all I don't know what the board wants to do that's why because we just paused what kind of cost um anything for advertising materials time sign whatever Plus
12% I just wanted to make people aware of that CU a cost of doing everything because we're going to have to figure out where that money comes from so that cuz it would be a breach of their contract so just so everyone's over when did you when when was the contract signed I don't know that I want
To say roughly three months ago but don't quote me exactly do you think maybe not quite what do you think was it has it been that I just I don't know I time is like a I know okay that was all I wanted to add to to
The end here I guess we should we have sign I make a motion to oh you can make a motion to aurn sure I didn't know I thought you wanted
To say something else so I yes 6:42 5:31 6:42 you need a sec I think it's second 641 all in
Favor oh okay I'll start on these
[Music] said [Music]
Do it all day at so double double the amount yes I'm trying I'm going to take my lunch yes I will be
Here okay help me can I bring a swap said
[00:00:00] the pilot program and we also have a [00:00:02] quick vote on some uh [00:00:05] licenses and um yeah that's it so I [00:00:09] would ask everybody to stand for the [00:00:12] Pledge of Allegiance I pledge of [00:00:15] aliance United States [00:00:23] Amer with liberty and [00:00:25] justice all right thank [00:00:27] you we are going to quickly [00:00:30] um vote on some licenses that still had [00:00:34] uh needed [00:00:36] inspections [00:00:38] um whatever yeah what if you want to [00:00:41] call the order uh call me the order at [00:00:44] uh [00:00:46] 531 um and this me this meeting is also [00:00:48] being recorded and is on um our YouTube [00:00:51] channel too just so everyone's [00:00:56] aware um so we finished up our um [00:01:00] application process um the building [00:01:02] inspector police department and finance [00:01:04] I mean sorry not Finance fire department [00:01:07] has done all their inspections so I'm [00:01:09] asking tonight that the select board [00:01:11] renew uh the following licenses tons of [00:01:14] stuff to sign um for common vict [00:01:16] licenses the southberry rot and Gun Club [00:01:19] Hardwick Vineyard and Winery also their [00:01:21] in holders license Eagle Hill Foundation [00:01:24] Hardwick Rod and Gun Club dctf Corp uh [00:01:29] the Old Furnace General Store Hardwick [00:01:31] market and Package Store Mimi's Coffee [00:01:33] House of Hardwick Hardwick Crossing [00:01:36] Hardwick House of Pizza and the Whistle [00:01:38] Stop restaurant for common vular and for [00:01:41] Class 2 and class three Auto renewals um [00:01:45] LNS used auto parts glesby Car Care [00:01:49] One gagy garage LJ ay repair motor [00:01:54] Specialties company Hardwick Auto [00:01:57] Sales regions repair l Associates um and [00:02:01] there were two companies that did not uh [00:02:03] renew this year um and those are [00:02:05] Anderson Restorations and cler Classics [00:02:08] because they didn't want to they were [00:02:11] nonresponsive okay yeah [00:02:16] okay asking uh the board to approve [00:02:19] those following [00:02:20] licenses I would move that we Grant the [00:02:24] uh common Vic dealer's [00:02:27] license together and in holder and class [00:02:29] two and class three yes okay I'll second [00:02:33] okay any other discussion all in favor [00:02:37] I do you want to sign them at the end [00:02:40] sure okay yeah that's great thank [00:02:44] you okay um really quick um this is um [00:02:50] we have a surplus equipment list in [00:02:52] front of us that um went to auction the [00:02:55] selectboard has to deem it as Surplus so [00:02:58] that it can um just for U Pit Lake [00:03:01] paperwork matter um if we could approve [00:03:04] this list that Marty gave us for [00:03:08] Surplus you going to read it sure 1998 [00:03:14] trackless mtst tractor trackless [00:03:18] sweeper uh trackless tires and steel [00:03:21] rims trackless snowblower Parts poly [00:03:25] tailgate poly tank Meers [00:03:28] sander 30C e yd Packer body 1988 Elgen [00:03:34] Pelican [00:03:35] sweeper it's an 86 86 1986 Elgen Pelican [00:03:40] sweeper 1999 Crown Vic police [00:03:45] interceptor 2002 Dodge Ram 1500 pickup [00:03:49] truck and a 1987 Ash Goos dumper sander [00:03:58] combination I that we put these out for [00:04:02] surplus [00:04:04] auction second it any other discussion [00:04:08] all those in favor [00:04:11] I okay thanks now on [00:04:36] to [00:04:42] get actually I have one oh you [00:04:46] do okay so the copy that Justine just [00:04:51] handed out to us is um you know Bill [00:04:54] drafted this and then it went to Town [00:04:57] Council Town Council made um notes on it [00:05:00] and this is a combination of that so [00:05:04] they [00:05:06] um their comments have been um [00:05:10] implemented into this new copy that [00:05:14] we're looking at [00:05:16] tonight [00:05:19] um have you guys had a chance to go over [00:05:22] it and [00:05:23] um as a board yeah no [00:05:27] okay no [00:05:32] do you have comments individually then [00:05:35] well I guess we could probably start [00:05:36] with [00:05:41] um I just want to get to see what some [00:05:44] of the changes are so I have I have one [00:05:47] that was sent out um couple weeks ago is [00:05:51] that that might be the same one so one [00:05:55] of the changes is they wanted to Define [00:05:58] what tax ined so on [00:06:01] the on third page third paragraph down [00:06:07] says this policy shall apply to all [00:06:09] nonprofits that are classified ex as [00:06:12] exempt from taxation under General [00:06:16] law yeah looks like it's the same ver [00:06:19] okay all right sorry [00:06:23] I [00:06:25] um so F first of all question I have how [00:06:29] many nonprofits are in [00:06:32] Hardware 109 properties 109 properties [00:06:42] exemp I do you want to see it there's [00:06:44] actually I mean there's [00:06:47] 152 but the town of Plick obviously is [00:06:52] exempt so it brings it down to 109 [00:06:55] properties okay does include state land [00:06:58] M yeah [00:07:01] so what are the top what are the top [00:07:04] it's doublesided to just say is it like [00:07:06] at a top five of large nonprofits in [00:07:10] town [00:07:10] that would be the [00:07:14] state but the state's not going to give [00:07:16] us [00:07:18] anything they do now they're not they're [00:07:21] not going to fall into this policy I [00:07:23] think well according to the policy way [00:07:26] it's written they are okay right yeah so [00:07:29] we've got [00:07:34] um' got the state has a bunch [00:07:38] um Eagle Hill has a bunch they are they [00:07:41] are currently already into pilot [00:07:43] programs with us now though okay [00:07:48] um there you know the [00:07:50] churches libraries common Land [00:07:53] Trust um hyck area conservation trust I [00:07:57] don't know that was the early name of [00:08:00] the land trust oh okay yeah okay thank [00:08:04] you and and just to make clear um Kelly [00:08:09] the state does pay us a it already corre [00:08:12] and then the other the department of [00:08:15] fisheries and wildlife comes in on the [00:08:17] cherry sheet right that's so we get [00:08:19] monies from the state both ways y okay [00:08:24] um just just to be clear that little bit [00:08:26] of money the exact numbers if I recall [00:08:28] right from this year were [00:08:31] 94,000 [00:08:33] for cherry sheet and what was it it was [00:08:38] that was specifically from the state for [00:08:41] the for [00:08:42] the the pilot is [00:08:45] like0 190 Al together um the pilot [00:08:49] itself the Caron Reservoir is a pilot [00:08:53] right that's [00:08:54] 190 and then um then the cherry sheet [00:08:58] was what 94 years said I think it [00:09:02] is so the CH sheet is specifically the [00:09:05] department of fisheries and wild that we [00:09:09] get on the cherry sheet yes and the [00:09:11] pilot [00:09:12] is yeah DC DCR DCR [00:09:18] yeah so the 109 [00:09:21] properties how many of them are state is [00:09:25] it quite a bit I I didn't do that count [00:09:28] I just took ours [00:09:34] you [00:09:35] could be [00:09:42] great and is [00:09:44] um heagle Hill one property or is there [00:09:48] main campus and then [00:09:50] there's as is um like the land trust is [00:09:54] multiple locations each location yeah is [00:09:57] listed on the on the sheet [00:10:01] so not all not all properties are going [00:10:03] to are going to really provide are going [00:10:05] to require services from us someone if [00:10:07] it's it's vacant land they don't [00:10:11] necessarily need school [00:10:15] police I guess it little fire than fire [00:10:18] but that's what we've been working under [00:10:20] since the master plan days we get that [00:10:22] from American Farmland trust [00:10:25] yeah it in the long term it saves the [00:10:28] town money to keep the land undeveloped [00:10:31] and we've talked with the assessors [00:10:34] about that over the years and I I think [00:10:37] that's true it's never been looked at [00:10:40] carefully and that's one thing I'd like [00:10:42] to see now is we do some kind of cost [00:10:46] benefit analysis to see what the truth [00:10:50] is well from my perspective um any piece [00:10:54] of property in town that gets [00:10:57] developed is is going to have a NE [00:10:59] negative impact on the town Financial [00:11:02] financially especially if you bring kids [00:11:03] in so if you're going to collect call it [00:11:07] 5 or $7,000 in taxes and you're paying [00:11:09] out $20,000 per kid right there you're [00:11:12] already in the hole so um one of the [00:11:15] things that that worries me and this [00:11:18] happened at a prior town is that [00:11:19] somebody came in bought some property [00:11:22] and then um came with a um a [00:11:27] 40b housing devel [00:11:29] that would have cost the town several [00:11:31] million dollars in [00:11:33] additional Services each year which [00:11:36] would have bankrupt us um we want to [00:11:39] prevent that the town end up having to [00:11:41] pay them out and it cost them I think I [00:11:44] paid I paid $800,000 for a land and we [00:11:46] paid them we bought them out for $3 to [00:11:48] $5 million Chris doesn't have to go [00:11:50] through the planning board what's that [00:11:51] doesn't have to go through the planning [00:11:52] board not not 40 B if we don't have [00:11:55] enough oh no it's 11% if we don't have [00:11:58] enough uh inexpensive housing in town [00:12:01] then we're open to this by law yeah up [00:12:04] to 11% I think is the [00:12:07] 11 so um I'm just trying to understand [00:12:11] the the policy here where you're looking [00:12:13] at revenues so you're looking at [00:12:16] businesses correct or profits that [00:12:19] nonprofits that that generate Revenue [00:12:22] that's what [00:12:23] this I read it was about 3 or 5% Revenue [00:12:26] you wanted to M so it wouldn't so it [00:12:30] really wouldn't pertain to vacant land [00:12:33] if there's no Revenue being [00:12:37] generated well nonprofits do take in [00:12:40] revenue and it's tied to their 990 [00:12:45] form okay that's what we there okay but [00:12:49] like the this the com with the mask M [00:12:52] How would how would we how would we go [00:12:54] out to the state for for this [00:12:57] policy that's we have to work on work on [00:13:01] okay and and the state is addressing [00:13:03] local follow that well yeah U just for [00:13:06] the record approximately 12 square miles [00:13:09] of this community is owned by the state [00:13:11] of Massachusetts it's masswell white and [00:13:15] thec DC DC 12 square miles out [00:13:21] 42 [00:13:25] subanal and there is a a push to [00:13:29] um get some kind of income for the towns [00:13:32] that are around the Quin in terms of us [00:13:35] protecting the water shed and that's an [00:13:39] initiative that's coming out of the [00:13:40] other side of the reservoir but um I [00:13:44] think the small towns all around are [00:13:46] starting to get into it [00:13:50] yeah uh under the contribution structure [00:13:54] um you're looking for a uh contribution [00:13:57] rate of 3 to 5% of both [00:14:06] my copy just three the old just [00:14:13] three and then one of the changes was [00:14:15] the catchup search charge instead of you [00:14:18] know Going Back 40 years basically just [00:14:21] go back to six [00:14:24] [Applause] [00:14:27] years and and would you apply the same [00:14:30] logic to [00:14:31] U [00:14:34] churches to percent of their [00:14:41] revenue Church helps the [00:14:45] community and there's there's exemptions [00:14:48] in here and they fall into the [00:14:50] exemptions they fall into the exemptions [00:14:52] where are the exemptions [00:14:55] B is [00:14:59] kind contributions and Community [00:15:01] benefits article 6 so how how is that [00:15:05] how is that going to be [00:15:07] Quantified because quantify I'm the [00:15:15] trable that would be up to the [00:15:17] organization inst sty us okay so let's [00:15:20] say [00:15:21] example they give I don't know a [00:15:24] thousand Community [00:15:25] dos working around town doing stuff even [00:15:29] at minimum wage $15 should do it ter [00:15:33] that's [00:15:34] 15,000 so they can quantify a will [00:15:41] inct but I me just to make it clear that [00:15:44] you would consider churches to be part [00:15:46] of this pilot program I do not the [00:15:49] churches are not costing the or [00:15:51] impacting this commun okay okay so it [00:15:54] does have an impact on the [00:15:56] community so they wouldn't be compelled [00:15:58] to [00:15:59] quantify their contribution to the [00:16:01] community I I have a hard time I'm just [00:16:04] going to interject because I feel like [00:16:06] we're making personal exemptions for [00:16:09] what one person thinks might [00:16:13] be make it exe exempt but maybe I don't [00:16:16] feel [00:16:17] that I think it needs to be a little bit [00:16:19] more you know black and white not yeah I [00:16:24] don't know [00:16:26] I so I mean you mention mention how [00:16:29] building and additional students well [00:16:33] Eagle Hill builds housing and their tax [00:16:35] exempt correct right now and that impact [00:16:39] of their staff sending their students to [00:16:42] our Public School cost us as a community [00:16:46] yeah we pay for that yes so there should [00:16:48] definitely be some so some reimbursement [00:16:51] for that definitely anything that [00:16:54] anything that's putting kids in the [00:16:55] school should be we should be looking at [00:16:57] pretty hard um because [00:17:00] the cost of public education is so [00:17:03] incredibly expensive expensive but [00:17:05] they're in a pilot program right now to [00:17:07] pay taxes on on the [00:17:10] properties [00:17:12] that came off the tax that came off the [00:17:15] tax R they don't have to pay on that but [00:17:18] they entered into a pilot program to do [00:17:20] you know to do that well I'm just [00:17:22] looking at this policy here how how it's [00:17:24] How do we cover that that' be the [00:17:26] biggest thing that I think we'd want to [00:17:28] if there if there's a big impact on Town [00:17:31] Services School mhm police fire anything [00:17:35] else then you'd want to certainly want [00:17:37] to cover some of that M or cover that [00:17:39] cost right um but I don't see it spelled [00:17:43] out in here to address that that's [00:17:48] all I think you'd have to we'd have to [00:17:50] come up with a way [00:17:52] to uh I mean the direct benefits if [00:17:56] we're talking Eagle Hill [00:17:59] Eagle Hill has contributed to the [00:18:00] ambulance in days gone by and recently a [00:18:04] big generator that lets us keep the fire [00:18:08] department independent and never asked [00:18:12] for anything I I look at things like [00:18:14] they the one of the biggest employer [00:18:16] they are probably the biggest employer [00:18:17] in town too [00:18:19] M I think those are things that you do [00:18:21] have to you know take into consideration [00:18:24] when we first talked about this we we [00:18:26] mentioned that each you know any of [00:18:29] these [00:18:29] exempt you know Properties or [00:18:34] um you know Property Owners it would be [00:18:37] you know it would be that we sit down [00:18:40] and have a discussion with them it's [00:18:42] it's voluntary to do this so [00:18:47] um this policies voluntary or this is a [00:18:50] policy this is a policy to set something [00:18:52] in place so it blankets the town yeah [00:18:54] okay and then we individually negotiate [00:18:57] with say eagle Hill each Land Trust [00:18:59] every individual nonprofit be have its [00:19:03] own agreement right okay but it's [00:19:06] voluntary it is they could refuse to [00:19:09] they could refuse absolutely that's [00:19:11] their choice y so this is more of a kind [00:19:14] of outline of how you see it working and [00:19:17] structuring it exactly but I I also [00:19:21] think that Eric makes a good point about [00:19:23] you know cost doing a you know cost [00:19:26] analysis on what is it that that what is [00:19:29] the impact yeah you know what is that [00:19:32] number look like when it excuse me when [00:19:35] it comes to you know whether it's the [00:19:37] fire needing to respond or the or the [00:19:39] police department needing to respond [00:19:43] um there post to the cost of a new of a [00:19:47] new family moving in with a couple of [00:19:49] kids in [00:19:50] school you know I mean we Jen and I have [00:19:53] talked about this since a long time ago [00:19:56] and 2005 but I've never se5 yes this was [00:20:01] brought up a long time ago we've never [00:20:03] and we got a pilot agreement with eagle [00:20:06] Hiller those days well we figured it I [00:20:09] didn't see that agreement until [00:20:11] 2014 okay I you know of an agreement [00:20:15] there was a verbal agreement before that [00:20:17] with PJ and Eric that they paid $25,000 [00:20:21] a year and then it shifted to the [00:20:23] properties going back on the on the tax [00:20:26] roll per se correct please correct [00:20:29] and it also excludes the campus and then [00:20:33] correct okay well because they are tax [00:20:35] exent organization well um so they pay [00:20:40] on to they pay on the the properties [00:20:43] that they own um that people live in [00:20:46] correct no like the properties that are [00:20:50] off the roles huh sorry I'm just what [00:20:52] are you asking the the taxes that are [00:20:55] paid on the properties it's the [00:20:57] properties throughout town that you own [00:20:59] you pay taxes on 10 individual homes and [00:21:02] four separate Parcels of land thank you [00:21:05] thank you and that's what was so that's [00:21:08] the it's like a percentage of the actual [00:21:11] real estate tax on those [00:21:15] individual yep that's not fire pilot [00:21:19] that is that is [00:21:20] the basis that was signed in 2014 and [00:21:24] then just last year they signed another [00:21:27] pilot um [00:21:29] for the sewer the betterments on the [00:21:31] sewer so if you sell a house then it [00:21:35] comes off for tax RS just as if anybody [00:21:37] else sells a house it's [00:21:40] correct to the that point it be on the [00:21:43] tax base tax RS [00:21:46] right person bu back on correct correct [00:21:50] how many students attend our school from [00:21:52] you [00:21:54] go I don't have that they don't [00:22:00] that that like uh EMP like employees [00:22:03] children's but yeah I don't I wouldn't [00:22:04] have that I live on [00:22:06] campus I don't know I don't have that I [00:22:08] think if I there are three Stu there may [00:22:13] be three students who are not in houses [00:22:15] or other things that are paying taxes [00:22:17] that are say in the dorm or on the [00:22:20] actual campus that's not that wouldn't [00:22:21] be part would be free so only three kids [00:22:24] are attending the school no no there are [00:22:26] more that attending the school but [00:22:27] Others May Live in properties that are [00:22:29] paying taxes to the town to be something [00:22:31] that we rent or one of the taxes the [00:22:34] houses that are covered in the pilot [00:22:35] program but there are only three that [00:22:37] are in on the correct okay that's [00:22:41] correct that makes [00:22:43] sense do we have a total number students [00:22:46] could you get us a total number I can [00:22:47] get it all right thank [00:22:49] you so getting back to the policy um I [00:22:53] think if we had a policy that would [00:22:56] cover the cost the hard cost of the [00:22:59] hard CA so school being one of them that [00:23:01] can easily take kids we got them up [00:23:04] multiply it by whatever that [00:23:06] is because from I think from from a [00:23:10] finance port's perspective is we're just [00:23:12] trying to you know we're not trying to [00:23:14] make money off this we just trying to [00:23:15] cover our costs exactly and um and [00:23:19] certainly with the in kind contributions [00:23:21] that um like an needle Hill would offer [00:23:25] us for you know whatever you know a [00:23:29] generator or use of fields or anything [00:23:32] else that that they would do um we've [00:23:36] got to we've got to take that into [00:23:37] account because it it adds a lot of [00:23:39] value to the town to the town's people [00:23:41] in the community which is very very [00:23:43] important um and that should be weighed [00:23:45] in in terms of you know there's going to [00:23:48] be some cost but there's also some [00:23:49] benefit that town gets as well that we [00:23:52] probably will have to you we have to pay [00:23:54] for um they let us use their facility [00:23:57] for our trainings and stuff too [00:23:59] okay that's great so I think a policy [00:24:03] and and I find it hard you know being a [00:24:06] being someone from the finance Community [00:24:08] is you know I I've worked in nonprofit [00:24:12] you take 3% of Revenue off a nonprofit [00:24:14] and they they're not make they're [00:24:17] they're out of business here's a [00:24:18] question have you looked at their taxes [00:24:20] who anybody's any nonprofit in town have [00:24:24] you visited their 991 well I can tell [00:24:27] you right now from from a revenue [00:24:28] standpoint they're not making 3 to 5% in [00:24:32] net [00:24:33] profit forms might say different okay so [00:24:37] it's worth a [00:24:39] look yeah I'm just saying from from you [00:24:42] know ad joural business people you know [00:24:44] businesses have to tax I know I know [00:24:46] nonprofit tax but um you know they're [00:24:50] not [00:24:50] making not making 10 20 30% in profit [00:24:56] profit so I think we just got to and [00:24:59] this is a we got to look at this across [00:25:00] the board get it if you've got something [00:25:03] in particular that's that's I just don't [00:25:05] think the town should be [00:25:08] subsidizing these [00:25:10] nonprofits it should be fair and [00:25:12] reasonable yeah I think if you if they [00:25:14] covered Services right then that's all [00:25:17] we [00:25:19] need and we have to look at what they [00:25:22] bring into the town yeah I mean I'm a [00:25:24] real fan of the land trust you know [00:25:27] there people that come here and go [00:25:28] biking and hiking and stuff benefit from [00:25:31] the land trucks of course keeping the [00:25:33] land open is I Believe In My Soul a [00:25:37] benefit for the town so you know evil [00:25:40] Hill does a lot of cultural stuff and I [00:25:43] hardly ever [00:25:45] go um I did with PJ have an agreement [00:25:49] that if I had to move the quaba Estates [00:25:51] people out because they're all electric [00:25:53] down there almost brought them up into [00:25:56] the into the dining hall you know for [00:25:59] shelter cuz all those buildings are [00:26:01] independent I don't have a memorandum of [00:26:04] understanding right now but I can see [00:26:07] myself looking for one so I'm talking [00:26:09] emergency stuff so you know there are [00:26:12] benefits to I mean there's different [00:26:15] ways to look at it and it's going to be [00:26:17] hard to come up with numbers but I think [00:26:18] we should try to do that Adam chair [00:26:22] agree can I say something I wasn't [00:26:24] really going to talk but I guess I can [00:26:25] never not talk um so when I first [00:26:29] originally was approached with this I [00:26:31] was under the impression that it was it [00:26:32] so it's OB obviously we all know it's [00:26:34] voluntary it was for you know new [00:26:37] nonprofits or businesses that wanted to [00:26:39] come into town and also looking at the [00:26:41] ones that are already here but I I guess [00:26:43] I didn't because it's a voluntary [00:26:45] program and I think it's a good program [00:26:48] I didn't necessarily think it needed to [00:26:49] be I guess scrutinized to this level [00:26:52] because I really thought because it's a [00:26:53] voluntary program and we're putting a [00:26:55] baseline in place um setting like you [00:26:58] know up to five and like putting you [00:27:00] know minimums in there I thought I [00:27:02] thought this would have been a good [00:27:03] thing overall not just to single out any [00:27:05] one [00:27:06] entity that's all I to say I mean we've [00:27:09] spent a lot of time and effort on this [00:27:12] and seems like nothing went into the [00:27:14] previous Pilots like that just showed up [00:27:17] got approved and that was it there was [00:27:19] no input from the town There's No [00:27:21] discussion there was no anything Council [00:27:24] didn't even look at some of them sorry [00:27:27] done talking well I this comes from not [00:27:29] the whole board here though I'm not a [00:27:33] fan of this and I haven't been involved [00:27:35] in any of this so I mean I know it's [00:27:38] gone off to [00:27:39] council but I mean I I think we need to [00:27:42] look at it really carefully when in here [00:27:45] it says the town feels this and the town [00:27:47] feels that I feel a little edgy with [00:27:50] that I don't think we've voted on it yet [00:27:53] so no we [00:27:55] haven't still up for a vote eventually [00:27:58] we'll eventually get there it's a draft [00:28:00] right so working draft how would it [00:28:02] affect like [00:28:03] someone taking aside the state and he's [00:28:07] cor Land Trust in evil Hill like what is [00:28:10] the harick historical society I mean [00:28:12] have they would they have no Revenue no [00:28:15] no not the town you know um although [00:28:18] it's considered their own thing but priv [00:28:20] but it's yeah um you know that's like [00:28:25] the I mean is that cuz that's not the [00:28:28] say that again gilafi Library that's not [00:28:30] all by time right it's not no you know [00:28:33] the water departments are on this list [00:28:34] as well and I mean I don't but so how do [00:28:37] they get scrutinized for the other well [00:28:39] that's just it like that's why I feel [00:28:42] like we're being we're kind of [00:28:45] like I feel like we're maybe targeting [00:28:49] just specific ones and it has to be they [00:28:51] all have to be looked at if we're going [00:28:53] to do something like this and I don't [00:28:55] think that we [00:28:56] can you know says how you know what what [00:28:59] is an exempt and then what are you know [00:29:01] some some justifications for being [00:29:04] exempt from this [00:29:06] um you know my view on that is going to [00:29:09] be probably different than yours so how [00:29:11] you know it's not black and white in [00:29:13] here I I worry about that and it not [00:29:16] being [00:29:18] um can they ever be dark and white I [00:29:20] mean I'm just I'm just trying to make [00:29:22] this black I don't have the I don't have [00:29:25] all the answers that's for sure well at [00:29:27] the end of the day [00:29:29] we just basically don't want a nonprofit [00:29:32] costing the town and the taxpayers money [00:29:34] agre period agre you carry your [00:29:37] own it and we can we can analyze we can [00:29:42] do whatever studies you like get all the [00:29:44] police calls the fire calls the [00:29:46] ambulance calls the Su all that and put [00:29:49] a dollar to Donuts number on it well [00:29:53] everybody can quantify it and get it [00:29:55] yeah if we go back to the policy though [00:29:56] the policy doesn't isn't doesn't read [00:29:59] that way that's the point I'm trying to [00:30:00] make like if if we could if we could get [00:30:03] if we had a policy that we've got the [00:30:05] town hall either through a reimbursement [00:30:08] of money or a reimbursement through some [00:30:09] sort of value ad M um I think we I think [00:30:14] we'd all be fine with that but what this [00:30:17] doesn't read this way that's that's the [00:30:19] this is just looking for 3% yeah and [00:30:22] then and I and I still it's it's still [00:30:24] in here I don't the catch-ups are charge [00:30:27] I I I have a hard time with that because [00:30:29] these are nonprofits and now you're [00:30:31] looking to to go back um 6 years I mean [00:30:36] that could [00:30:37] really that could that could really put [00:30:41] I think a a heartache on on anyone you [00:30:45] know the my concern is the Optics and [00:30:48] there are there are certain [00:30:50] organizations that that make a impact on [00:30:53] the town's expenses but many of these on [00:30:56] this list don't [00:30:58] so how do you distinguish between is it [00:31:00] just better to just pick up the phone [00:31:02] and start a conversation with some of [00:31:04] these people that you think especially [00:31:06] if we can as a community come up with a [00:31:09] cost of what it what they cost us to [00:31:12] operate in this community and that way [00:31:15] the Optics are a lot better that we're [00:31:17] looking at it not at the not at these 3% [00:31:21] of the St alicious church as an example [00:31:23] that they don't have 3% they don't and [00:31:26] the Optics would be you picking L [00:31:28] churches [00:31:29] for I mean that that's exactly what I [00:31:32] read here is you know you it's not black [00:31:36] and white enough so that you can draw [00:31:38] your own own conclusion on what where [00:31:41] you apply it I don't think it's a bad [00:31:44] idea they just it's a great idea but how [00:31:46] do you how do you make it black and [00:31:48] white so the Optics aren't so so I would [00:31:51] say um [00:31:53] irritated because it does look like that [00:31:55] to me in some cases I could think [00:31:58] half dozen examples [00:32:00] where it's foolish to even [00:32:05] ask they don't [00:32:08] disagree can we somehow get at this set [00:32:11] up a a working group some kind of is [00:32:15] that what this is MHM that's what this [00:32:17] is so I know so we have to compile facts [00:32:20] and figures and trying to keep it off [00:32:23] you dear you [00:32:25] know you're sweet yeah the biggest [00:32:28] impact of course is going to be the [00:32:30] school so you know but we could take it [00:32:33] we could take it down another road it [00:32:34] could be number of students number of [00:32:37] ambulance calls number of police calls [00:32:39] number of fire calls I mean you could [00:32:41] just look at that and [00:32:43] say where is it costing us [00:32:46] yeah and then make that pick up the [00:32:49] phone yeah say you you uh you we had uh [00:32:54] 15 ambulance calls to your organization [00:32:57] in this period of time yeah you [00:33:01] know that's the kind of quantitative [00:33:03] basis that you probably want to take a [00:33:05] look at [00:33:06] yeah yeah have it be something that [00:33:08] you're it's an manual review or you're [00:33:11] looking at it over a certain period of [00:33:12] time and it's negotiable for revisiting [00:33:16] so if at some point they're putting a [00:33:19] lot of having taking a lot of resources [00:33:20] but then something changes and they're [00:33:22] not then right you don't want to make [00:33:24] them have them pay for something that [00:33:27] they're not it's not cosing the [00:33:29] town I mean you could take [00:33:31] it the extreme of course is you're [00:33:35] plowing the street in front of this [00:33:37] place you want to take that I mean [00:33:39] there's certain things that you just [00:33:41] just take for granted that you're going [00:33:42] to take care of road because they're [00:33:45] open to the public well and I think [00:33:47] there's also I mean I I think there's [00:33:50] also something to be said about being a [00:33:51] good neighbor too um you know if if if [00:33:56] any of these entities like I said employ [00:34:00] the the people in town or I you [00:34:03] know I I [00:34:06] just yeah I don't know I just have a [00:34:08] hard time [00:34:10] um making it kind of very boil up [00:34:18] plate what do you want to [00:34:22] do I kind of like [00:34:24] the there's a scale of some sort don't [00:34:27] know like you [00:34:29] say do you account the ambulances do you [00:34:32] count the students and and that's that's [00:34:35] where you start your negotiation and say [00:34:37] yeah okay we do this we do this but also [00:34:40] we provide to the town a place for for a [00:34:44] you know all these things that may be a [00:34:47] town benefit that have a monetary value [00:34:50] to them um you know the church has the [00:34:53] food pantry in it you um so it could be [00:34:57] some intrin value to you have to take [00:34:59] into account too I don't think you can [00:35:02] quantify what a church does I mean it's [00:35:05] pretty difficult to put a value on that [00:35:08] no but it's it's a community service [00:35:11] that is provided that has some intrinsic [00:35:13] you know value [00:35:16] um as does Eagle Hill as does East quad [00:35:20] landfest I mean and it's hard to measure [00:35:22] enjoyment on a trail it's hard to [00:35:25] measure um the education [00:35:29] kids that are going to grow up and maybe [00:35:32] do wonderful things in this world you [00:35:33] know I mean that that that's their job [00:35:35] is to [00:35:37] um is to educate what do you think the [00:35:41] U property owner of 12 square miles of [00:35:44] this community is going to tell you when [00:35:46] you say give us your your value that you [00:35:50] you bring to the community I mean there [00:35:53] yeah they're the biggest violator I mean [00:35:55] of the who mean St State absolutely and [00:35:59] and their amount of money we've been [00:36:02] trying to fight that fight for a long [00:36:04] time now unfortunately um you know we do [00:36:07] get you know obviously we do get some [00:36:09] money but um you know maybe not to the [00:36:13] yeah 12 s miles right but as as the [00:36:16] policy is written they wouldn't pay us [00:36:19] anything it's voluntary because there's [00:36:21] no Revenue not generating [00:36:23] Revenue we already get but there's the [00:36:26] the cherry sheet in the uh [00:36:28] and the pilot from the state is pretty [00:36:30] well documented yeah but this says 3% of [00:36:34] your Revenue but the state isn't right [00:36:36] they're not generating revenue for [00:36:38] having conservation land correct yeah so [00:36:42] they wouldn't yeah would even right it [00:36:44] would fall out of [00:36:46] it well the charge for the water yes so [00:36:49] then we'd have to take a piece of the [00:36:51] surrounding land all the way around for [00:36:53] the water shed would get complicated [00:36:56] yeah well that's what they try to do [00:36:57] trying to come up with some kind of [00:36:59] justification for that and should the [00:37:01] local town the surrounding towns around [00:37:04] thead that's where politicians come into [00:37:07] play we can we've had meetings with them [00:37:09] too yeah they've been they've been [00:37:12] present at those meetings I will say [00:37:14] they've been very present [00:37:17] so so to answer your your question about [00:37:21] do we work on this I think we start [00:37:24] with we I think payment in lower taxes [00:37:27] would to [00:37:28] cover cover the cost of the services we [00:37:31] provide that would be reasonable and [00:37:34] fair I think um and and we can look at [00:37:39] it through either um you know some sort [00:37:43] of contribution but they contribute to [00:37:45] the town or they contribute to it [00:37:47] financially and at least that gets us [00:37:49] whole that's all we're looking to try to [00:37:50] do yeah this isn't a profit Center for [00:37:54] us but you're not suggesting that we [00:37:56] charge a fee for the ambulance showing [00:37:59] up no because we don't we don't have [00:38:03] an we're paying for paying for ambulance [00:38:06] that trust me we're paying for right out [00:38:09] what [00:38:10] budget budget it's in the budg buget oh [00:38:12] it's in the [00:38:13] budget Barry and Westbrook field we pay [00:38:16] each one of them 100,000 maybe no 25 to [00:38:20] one and 35 to the other or 28 and 25 or [00:38:23] it's 60,000 in the budget for oh is that [00:38:25] the Emergency Services correct yeah okay [00:38:28] yeah yeah okay you don't want to get [00:38:30] into that habit though of charging no [00:38:33] you kind of look at what do you no but [00:38:34] you look at what you know like the cost [00:38:36] of it per se you know and um it's not [00:38:39] free no it's not free but try to put a [00:38:42] value to [00:38:43] it um something that's fair for both [00:38:46] both parties and I think I think I would [00:38:48] imagine [00:38:49] that non the nonprofits that that are [00:38:52] using the services would would be open [00:38:54] to how do we to be good good citizens [00:38:57] and again to be good neighbors neighbors [00:39:00] right how do we make this so it's not a [00:39:01] burden right right I mean that was the [00:39:05] initial you know I think that was your [00:39:08] that was why you proposed it m to to we [00:39:11] shouldn't be subsidizing to be and to [00:39:13] but to work together yeah to you know to [00:39:17] find that Common Ground [00:39:22] yeah well what's our next step then [00:39:30] any suggestion go to the fire department [00:39:32] and get a list of [00:39:35] calls well I think we got to we to start [00:39:37] with this [00:39:38] first it's it's very [00:39:41] much written [00:39:50] as you know the contribution structure [00:39:53] is [00:39:54] pretty this is what it's going to do mhm [00:39:58] um where I think it's on a on a Case by [00:40:02] case [00:40:03] basis and ultimately the contribution [00:40:06] structure is going to [00:40:07] be we would we would expect and want to [00:40:11] work with you to cover the cost of the [00:40:14] town's not out of out of Po actual like [00:40:16] cost that [00:40:18] yeah rather not a [00:40:21] percentage and then and then you know [00:40:24] have a structure where we're we're we're [00:40:26] revisiting this on a on a more frequent [00:40:30] basis because that cost truck could [00:40:32] change um and that way they everyone an [00:40:35] annual review yeah and everyone's [00:40:37] getting a fair shot of you know I mean [00:40:39] we do that when we when we partner up [00:40:41] with other communities for [00:40:42] intermunicipal agreements they're looked [00:40:44] at annually to see you know what were're [00:40:46] like say the senior center M you know [00:40:49] it's looked at annually to see how many [00:40:50] of our residents Go versus theirs and [00:40:53] can we pay based on that [00:40:57] listed under section four provid an [00:41:00] annual report on their usage of town [00:41:02] services to support pilot TPC okay [00:41:23] great we should think about a way to [00:41:27] I don't know how to do this but try to [00:41:29] put a a value on the [00:41:34] ephemeral stuff [00:41:37] the the joy of the beautiful land things [00:41:41] that don't have a dollar value per se or [00:41:44] in the church you know the the feeling [00:41:46] of [00:41:48] community community building and all the [00:41:50] other stuff that it's all it's what we [00:41:53] all want it's what the town is known for [00:41:56] but we don't have a way to put a dollar [00:41:59] on [00:42:00] it that probably it's impossible but I'm [00:42:03] just curious because you know I'm [00:42:05] listening to this I'm saying is there a [00:42:07] KN for profit that you would like to [00:42:09] have come to your [00:42:12] town could you think of one Doctors [00:42:16] Without or a n but I'm saying I guess [00:42:19] what I'm saying is you never given is [00:42:21] your is your policy is your [00:42:25] policy looked at as anti not for profit [00:42:29] I mean you don't have any control over [00:42:31] somebody that comes into town and buys [00:42:33] something because they're are not for [00:42:35] profit there's no control so the [00:42:37] question becomes does this become [00:42:40] something that's encouraging or [00:42:43] discouraging from that very flexible and [00:42:46] reasonable I did I'm I'm asking the [00:42:48] crowd I'm giving you my [00:42:51] input I don't have the answer to that [00:42:53] I'm just making that observation For [00:42:56] Thought yeah [00:43:00] medical [00:43:01] nonprofit which we want to attract [00:43:04] whether they would be that's a good one [00:43:06] yeah yeah [00:43:08] yeah you get the prize [00:43:11] an thank [00:43:14] you [00:43:19] um yeah I think I I just I said I have a [00:43:23] couple of [00:43:24] concerns um but I do think that it's [00:43:29] a I I don't think it's a bad idea to [00:43:31] have one in place I just think that it [00:43:33] needs to [00:43:38] be you know this this could be used as a [00:43:41] if written [00:43:43] carefully not that it [00:43:46] isn't as a tool to encourage you to pick [00:43:50] up the phone and have that conversation [00:43:52] instead of mandating that how many times [00:43:54] did the ambulance show up it's your [00:43:56] place I think our ambulance crew knows [00:43:58] that and how many times did the police [00:43:59] show up I think they know that and the [00:44:01] fire department knows that so we would [00:44:02] know that answer we don't need to put [00:44:04] that unnecessary burden on somebody else [00:44:06] to tell us that but to me this document [00:44:10] could force both parties to sit down and [00:44:12] make make some [00:44:16] Headway but I'm again I'm not [00:44:19] sure this document in [00:44:22] total is 100% what we want to do [00:44:27] my my opinion is you pick up the phone [00:44:30] somebody and say if you don't want this [00:44:32] let's get let's start talking [00:44:36] because this puts an undue burden on a [00:44:39] lot of people to try to make that to [00:44:41] follow that rule yeah and if it's all [00:44:43] voluntary we could just [00:44:45] say I don't want to talk to you did you [00:44:47] want to say something yeah I think um [00:44:50] because boards change Administration [00:44:52] change and I I think having you know [00:44:56] something down on paper that's harder to [00:44:59] change I think that's probably a good [00:45:01] idea because like I said wordss change [00:45:03] people you know people change [00:45:05] administrations change um that's nothing [00:45:08] wrong with boards changing and [00:45:09] administration's changing it happens [00:45:11] every day in government oh no that's not [00:45:12] what I meant yeah what do you mean then [00:45:14] I just to have to have the policy CH but [00:45:18] then every time a new board comes in [00:45:21] they can vote this out right you can't [00:45:22] this you just make this for your board [00:45:25] next election could be back in or back [00:45:28] out you can get a majority that's right [00:45:31] so so does it do you any good well needs [00:45:33] change in circumstances yeah everybody [00:45:35] you know there's there's something that [00:45:37] drives a certain agenda and that agenda [00:45:42] changes every Administration change very [00:45:47] true I think if we if it's a financial [00:45:51] policy the town adopts that we're trying [00:45:54] to not that we want to make should we [00:45:57] cover the costs M um that is just a [00:46:01] general Financial policy then you know [00:46:05] it's a Guiding Light that we as a town [00:46:08] will try to follow and then the policy [00:46:12] can the specifics of it can can change [00:46:15] here and there but ultimately we're just [00:46:16] trying to you know how do we cover our [00:46:18] costs provide great services and cover [00:46:20] the cost you know in MO taxes you said [00:46:22] it better than [00:46:24] me that's all I was trying to say okay [00:46:31] and then each board can as they change [00:46:33] you know we'll make a lot of money [00:46:34] lawyers [00:46:36] yeah that's what's going to [00:46:38] happen because there's too many too many [00:46:42] black and not black and white aspects of [00:46:45] this thing it it could be it could be [00:46:47] two sentences that exactly that's all it [00:46:51] that's what it needs to be needs to be [00:46:53] it needs to be a document that drives [00:46:55] you [00:46:57] in 2005 if it only needed to be two [00:46:59] sentences I moved in three years ago I [00:47:02] have no idea yeah me either okay but [00:47:05] we're here tonight right and you put [00:47:07] this simp you put this forward which was [00:47:09] a great start so we have a working [00:47:13] meeting let's talk through what we need [00:47:14] to do [00:47:16] yeah Solutions [00:47:23] yeah will it mean that you have to have [00:47:26] a um conversation with everybody on that [00:47:28] list call them up and say hey we have a [00:47:30] new policy we want you to you know the [00:47:32] church the library and say here's our [00:47:35] new [00:47:35] rules and they would come and sit with [00:47:38] you and negotiate a pilot is that kind [00:47:40] of [00:47:41] the that's the [00:47:45] place well they're not they not it's new [00:47:48] policy not a new rule because you can [00:47:50] it's voluntary right I mean it's not [00:47:52] voluntary they they will get called in [00:47:54] to to say there's [00:47:57] and the process [00:47:59] that it was mentioned that emergency [00:48:02] services police and stuff were getting [00:48:04] build bills were going out to these [00:48:06] nonprofits after three calls and that [00:48:09] hasn't been the case there was no [00:48:12] billing so there is cost involved in all [00:48:16] of these yeah and that wasn't happening [00:48:18] for whatever reason it did happen in the [00:48:21] past it has happened in the past well [00:48:23] it's not happening currently correct no [00:48:26] you [00:48:27] how long we don't [00:48:29] know 25s my smoke detector went off too [00:48:32] many times or [00:48:34] something [00:48:36] call the hardw fire department coming [00:48:38] and checking your no they thought there [00:48:41] was a fire they showed up they charged [00:48:44] after the third one there you go is that [00:48:48] recently um it's I yeah I haven't worked [00:48:52] here that long either so you fixed the [00:48:54] smoke detector I fixed the fire that [00:48:58] making the smoke that set off the [00:49:02] smoke the fireplace all right so [00:49:07] okay open the [00:49:09] flu [00:49:11] yeaha wasn't [00:49:16] that but it does sound like they have to [00:49:18] have the invitation for the conversation [00:49:21] that's all you're really looking for is [00:49:22] to say we'd like to we'd like to start [00:49:26] from scratch [00:49:28] but I wish is what when you're going to [00:49:29] call up the hard Historical Society [00:49:31] they're going to say sorry we have no [00:49:33] money right the church will say you [00:49:36] can't enter it I know it's voluntary [00:49:40] right and on and on [00:49:43] on I don't know you know the the land [00:49:46] trust is it how do you is that update [00:49:49] you said Revenue that's based on money [00:49:51] they take in as contributions that's not [00:49:54] really Revenue that's it's consider [00:49:57] contributions grants stuff like what [00:50:00] what would what would their what would [00:50:03] the um Demand on the town will I will [00:50:07] what's the demand Demand on the town [00:50:10] Services they probably get about 10 [00:50:12] calls a year for for lost people on turs [00:50:20] okay but but why why would that be the [00:50:24] the Land Trust issue versus well they're [00:50:28] supposed to maintain their trails and [00:50:30] maintain the property and have it [00:50:32] properly marked so people don't get lost [00:50:34] so why should it be the citizens paying [00:50:36] for those Emergency [00:50:38] Services you know what I mean it's this [00:50:42] balance yeah I know people get lost get [00:50:45] lost in own yard walking around [00:50:47] some going in the woods did you hear [00:50:49] about [00:50:53] that um I don't want to entertain a ton [00:50:56] of questions but I I see that your hand [00:50:58] was up [00:51:00] Bill well I'm trying to stay positive I [00:51:02] was a little disappointed that we didn't [00:51:04] have the most current material but I [00:51:08] think it I think it was there are there [00:51:09] are I think everyone [00:51:12] has I only have the old stuff the our [00:51:15] commission wasn't sent new I think [00:51:18] it I just looked at a version that he [00:51:20] had and there are things in it that are [00:51:22] oh it's different okay I apologize [00:51:28] well anyway Kelly that wasn't really my [00:51:29] point my point was trying to stay [00:51:31] positive um in relation to um Mr bhim's [00:51:35] comment um and through the discussion [00:51:38] we're hearing you know we've tried to [00:51:39] insert ourselves at times um it's [00:51:42] extremely important to acknowledge that [00:51:44] there are plenty of studies and surveys [00:51:46] that document the economic benefit to [00:51:49] communities local communities of open [00:51:51] space lands Trail networks recreational [00:51:55] access [00:51:57] um and to be honest I've worked for the [00:51:59] federal government and the state [00:52:01] government and I I don't appreciate [00:52:03] hearing that you know State ownership [00:52:05] would be considered violators when you [00:52:07] know they host Hunting Fishing hiking [00:52:10] bird [00:52:12] watching any number of things and the [00:52:15] people that come to enjoy that stuff [00:52:17] they benefit from our investment [00:52:19] including Town investment we just spent [00:52:22] several years improving some trails to [00:52:24] attract people and people are using them [00:52:27] the land trust spends plenty of effort [00:52:30] and money their stewardship Committee in [00:52:32] maintaining a trail Network that people [00:52:35] enjoy and come here [00:52:36] for these things result in economic [00:52:39] benefits to the town so my [00:52:42] recommendation is those things be [00:52:44] evaluated at the same time that service [00:52:47] requirements are being evaluated and [00:52:49] that's what we were saying is time [00:52:50] because it wouldn't feel Fair other to [00:52:52] put I don't know the I don't know how [00:52:54] you could put a dollar amount on but it [00:52:57] has to be considered there are studies [00:52:59] that estimate for Rural communities in [00:53:01] different places what what general [00:53:03] numbers for those kinds of things and [00:53:05] money spent in the area buying food [00:53:07] right because when people come in then [00:53:08] they're exactly buying gas buying food [00:53:11] recreating you know um whatever I mean [00:53:13] we even partnered with Mary Lan hospital [00:53:15] for God's sake for the Fitness trail so [00:53:17] there are benefits there are health [00:53:18] benefits things like that we can try to [00:53:20] look for some estimates of things like [00:53:22] that um if we're going to try to [00:53:25] evaluate costs in terms of services we [00:53:30] should balance those against benefits [00:53:32] because there are economic [00:53:34] benefits yeah no agreed I think I think [00:53:37] that's what we're all kind of saying [00:53:40] here is that all that has to be taken [00:53:42] into consideration when you know having [00:53:45] conversations with with these entities [00:53:47] for sure yeah bill in in the word [00:53:50] intrinsic value is probably which you [00:53:53] can't measure right is probably the [00:53:55] biggest one that you know in some cases [00:53:57] like you're you're citing as an example [00:54:00] of reasons why you would welcome [00:54:03] something like this into the community [00:54:05] yeah I was just trying that's why I was [00:54:06] asking you know could you think of [00:54:07] something that youd like to have that's [00:54:10] not for profit in this [00:54:11] community there are examples [00:54:15] yeah well land trust is one of them it's [00:54:18] hard to convert into dollars and cents [00:54:20] right you know but that's what I'm [00:54:21] trying to get at that there are some [00:54:23] estimates for dollars and cents we just [00:54:25] have to I just have to go find them or [00:54:26] we have to find them um you know that's [00:54:29] not counting the um whatever intrinsic [00:54:33] values of open space to the people that [00:54:36] live here and the other you know [00:54:38] citizens of the Commonwealth that want [00:54:39] to come and visit here because of the [00:54:41] vistas and Views and all that you [00:54:44] know good points well for every [00:54:47] subdivision that doesn't get put in [00:54:49] because you've now protected that land [00:54:52] you just saved the town right exactly [00:54:55] millions of dollars worth [00:54:57] that's what the cost of community the [00:54:58] cost of community services studies all [00:55:01] show that and we have four towns that [00:55:03] have been done repetitively in [00:55:04] Massachusetts the latest was not 2019 I [00:55:07] brought copies if you guys want those [00:55:10] cost Community Services study show I [00:55:13] would take a copy of that I would be [00:55:14] interested yeah I've handed those out [00:55:16] before but I I was happy to reprint a [00:55:19] bunch of these things just so the board [00:55:21] could spread them around and we have [00:55:24] them electronically [00:55:26] this proves that you know industrial [00:55:28] lands and Commercial lands pay their way [00:55:32] because they bring in more in taxes than [00:55:34] are paid out in services but residential [00:55:37] lands cost more in services to the town [00:55:39] as you pointed out than they will ever [00:55:41] bring in in [00:55:43] services so you could almost you could [00:55:46] view conserving some lands at least in [00:55:48] key locations as avoiding more expense [00:55:51] to the [00:55:52] town it is we're at 33% owned by profit [00:55:56] in this [00:55:57] time if if you include state if you want [00:56:00] to talk the land trust you're talking [00:56:01] three saying it's a pretty big number it [00:56:03] is just so you're aware of it it is I'm [00:56:07] pretty aware of [00:56:08] it but we also have clean [00:56:12] water 8,000 [00:56:14] Acres 8,000 Acres 12 square miles God [00:56:18] bless them they need water yeah because [00:56:20] of that we're custodians of the water [00:56:22] supply for all of eastern Mass and we [00:56:24] should get some credit and economic [00:56:26] benefit from that and I know certain [00:56:28] senators are proposing that and we [00:56:30] should all support and push hard for we [00:56:32] need to push hard we Steward their [00:56:36] water we don't have to be so good about [00:56:39] it you know you can't pick up the phone [00:56:41] and ask them to think [00:56:44] better going to no [00:56:46] incentive no incentive our [00:56:50] legisl I'm not sure what it is but we [00:56:52] can do that too okay okay so [00:56:58] I don't have all the answers for this [00:57:00] tonight but [00:57:01] um do you want to make some it's it's [00:57:05] two two sentences we'll make we'll we [00:57:08] can run it up pretty quick [00:57:10] okay where where did you find a magic [00:57:13] hat start all this I can I mean we'll [00:57:16] have I mean let's see what they come up [00:57:18] with to you know to to add to it maybe [00:57:24] um you know yeah let's come back at it [00:57:28] with some different ideas some new ideas [00:57:30] and you know and again don't this isn't [00:57:33] a bad idea I just has to be I do see you [00:57:35] Eric hold on um I just think that we [00:57:38] have to um I don't know I [00:57:42] just let's get some other ideas and boil [00:57:45] it down and see what we come up with [00:57:47] have another work session is there [00:57:49] something you can just do we can [00:57:51] distribute our comments to re okay with [00:57:54] that yep as long as no one's responding [00:57:56] and having a conversation about it back [00:57:58] and forth if you want me to compile them [00:58:00] I wouldn't mind doing that either all [00:58:03] you maybe do that and then and then [00:58:05] Jus can send send it out to all of us [00:58:09] Eric so the planning board passes a [00:58:13] bylaw it's enforced by the zoning [00:58:15] enforcement officer you guys write a [00:58:17] general bylaw it's enforced by you [00:58:20] through the police [00:58:21] department this policy is voluntary [00:58:26] there's no [00:58:27] enforcement I don't understand why you [00:58:30] would go through the process and [00:58:32] spending time and legal money counts [00:58:36] paying for legal to review this for a [00:58:40] policy that you can't [00:58:41] enforce what happens [00:58:44] when the two biggest nonprofits you're [00:58:47] talking about say thank you but I'm not [00:58:49] involved have a nice [00:58:52] day it's it's to me it's silly to pass a [00:58:54] rule that you can't [00:58:56] St well if it's a [00:58:59] financial [00:59:01] policy I like that idea it's just a [00:59:04] guideline right a guideline for what for [00:59:09] I the problem is and I can't speak for [00:59:12] the school or the land trust but if I [00:59:15] were them and I would say well wait a [00:59:16] minute I don't have to do this thank you [00:59:18] I'm not going to be involved so then [00:59:22] what well I mean eil is already doing [00:59:25] well they are so they are you know like [00:59:28] and yeah honestly I don't think they get [00:59:30] enough credit for all the other things [00:59:32] that they do but then they're forced [00:59:34] into saying well we're not going to be [00:59:36] involved so then what's the image of [00:59:38] that but they're already doing two [00:59:40] pilots that know right but I do feel [00:59:43] sorry no I I do feel to a certain extent [00:59:46] and based on some of the comments made [00:59:48] by by you in particular this evening [00:59:50] that you really are looking at Eagle [00:59:52] Hill and its use of of services and and [00:59:56] I think that if you were to set a policy [00:59:58] like this we're not going to be a the [01:00:00] one that you are proposing we are not [01:00:02] going to be able to pay and we won't and [01:00:04] so then what happens is is we will [01:00:06] become villainized in the eyes of the [01:00:08] town because we won't be be meeting the [01:00:11] need and we we've all experienced it [01:00:13] we've all seen it most people probably [01:00:16] don't know that we pay two pilots right [01:00:18] now most people probably don't know that [01:00:21] we probably pay more taxes than anybody [01:00:24] else in town right nobody knows that we [01:00:28] forgave nearly $500,000 in the loan when [01:00:31] it came to the sore people don't know [01:00:33] those things so if we were to come up [01:00:35] with a new policy that essentially [01:00:37] negates the existing policies and we [01:00:40] can't meet the guideline that you set [01:00:43] then it's going to be Eagle Hill hasn't [01:00:45] done what it needs for the town which is [01:00:47] why I think that working with it the the [01:00:50] the entities individually is one way of [01:00:53] going about [01:00:54] it um but I I guess in my in my view [01:00:58] this wouldn't even apply to you because [01:01:00] you're already into pilot programs and [01:01:02] you already have done the like you just [01:01:05] said you know the the Forgiveness of the [01:01:07] money and when it came down to the sore [01:01:10] I I I don't look at this being something [01:01:13] that you would even have to do in my [01:01:15] opinion right because as you're already [01:01:18] in a pilot well and I would hope that [01:01:21] when we enter my hope also is that when [01:01:24] we enter in these agreements [01:01:26] that that that there's value to those [01:01:29] agreements right that it's not just just [01:01:32] for the time period in which it's [01:01:33] convenient but that we've done it all in [01:01:36] good faith and we've entered it not that [01:01:38] okay now this one doesn't work so we're [01:01:40] not going to do this one anymore you [01:01:42] know but I I I appreciate what you're [01:01:44] saying Kelly and I and I I believe what [01:01:47] you're saying but I don't think that [01:01:49] that's the intent of the whole [01:01:51] world I think the nonprofit should cover [01:01:54] their cost if you're burden on the town [01:01:57] well I don't view Eagle Hill school as a [01:01:59] burden on this town if you look at the [01:02:01] number of students that you send to our [01:02:03] public school and just do the math on [01:02:05] that we run a negative on this town and [01:02:07] most of those students live in houses [01:02:08] that are having taxes paid on them you [01:02:11] can also look you can also look at the [01:02:13] students that are here in town that go [01:02:15] to [01:02:16] eag there there's a perfect example [01:02:19] where Eagle Hill is burden on this town [01:02:22] you get us the number we'll sit down [01:02:24] we'll talk [01:02:26] and and also being a charitable [01:02:28] organization you're not supposed to be a [01:02:30] third [01:02:31] Community you're supposed to run an [01:02:33] organization and you're supposed to know [01:02:36] and work with the community don't be a [01:02:38] bur on the community we absolutely work [01:02:41] with the community well we there's a [01:02:43] list of things that they've all [01:02:45] mentioned that we do just saying well [01:02:48] let's start with the students it's not [01:02:50] my opinion it's [01:02:52] numbers it's numbers number of students [01:02:55] going to public school at roughly 20 [01:02:57] grand [01:02:58] ahead just [01:03:01] numbers okay and then you'll have to [01:03:03] deduct all the value that we do bring [01:03:05] all the jobs all all the businesses that [01:03:08] get visited by the people we bring in [01:03:10] all the [01:03:11] programming everything else that gets [01:03:18] done okay respond Eric Eric I think the [01:03:22] the policy is really for to have a [01:03:24] policy in place so a new if if a new [01:03:26] nonprofit came in it would be a [01:03:29] guideline of this is what we're trying [01:03:31] to do in terms of meeting the obligation [01:03:33] of what your services are not you know [01:03:37] the existing is the existing he's been [01:03:39] going on for I mean the policy would [01:03:42] hopefully apply to it but I think from [01:03:45] our standpoint having something a [01:03:46] financial policy in place that would [01:03:48] cover anything new at least at least you [01:03:50] got something you can you can go on from [01:03:52] a foundation to work with yeah yeah well [01:03:55] like kind of get it but it's still [01:03:56] voluntary it is voluntary and you know [01:03:59] again to me it's all about enforcement M [01:04:03] right the bylaws you can enforce those [01:04:05] this you can't yeah and I just don't see [01:04:09] the ex going through this exercise if at [01:04:12] the end of the day [01:04:14] there's they don't have to deal with it [01:04:18] you don't have to comply with it and I [01:04:20] just find that sort of silly to go [01:04:22] through that too I mean I think you [01:04:25] could do do it other ways I mean I would [01:04:27] ask has the board ever approached the [01:04:29] school about any of these issues within [01:04:32] the past 5 [01:04:34] years well I think this is an eagle Hill [01:04:36] issue it's I'm just we're just talking [01:04:38] about a finance policy that would be [01:04:40] right yeah I don't think I don't think [01:04:42] any one entity should be should be you [01:04:48] know yeah thank you thank my words just [01:04:51] weren coming you know it shouldn't that [01:04:55] shouldn't be the case [01:04:56] if we get into an Enforcement issue [01:04:59] we've lost it right that's not where we [01:05:02] need to go right correct it's not where [01:05:03] we can afford to go just here a [01:05:05] community work it together I think that [01:05:08] there are policies in place in in other [01:05:11] towns and I think that the [01:05:13] entities they decide what of sort of [01:05:17] what they're able to pay of of what [01:05:19] they've been requested you know I would [01:05:22] ask I would suggest that you might even [01:05:23] look at the city of Boston and what [01:05:25] they've done with a lot of the [01:05:27] universities and and places that are in [01:05:29] the city of Boston they they have what [01:05:31] is nationally sort of heralded as a as a [01:05:34] solid program um where and it it it [01:05:38] takes into account what those entities [01:05:41] um how they benefit the city of Boston [01:05:45] um and not all you know Harvard [01:05:47] University is paying 75% of what's being [01:05:50] requested not there you know they're not [01:05:52] all meeting the requests but if you're [01:05:54] looking just for a [01:05:56] a a guideline or a policy I mean that's [01:05:59] something you may want to investigate [01:06:01] what they [01:06:05] do okay um well do we all want to get [01:06:10] our thoughts to Justine have them [01:06:12] recirculated and do another working [01:06:14] meeting in January [01:06:31] a deep cleaning that I just set up well [01:06:35] I just it should be maybe not not a [01:06:38] regular meeting I just assume it be [01:06:40] another meeting where we can just [01:06:41] discuss you know [01:06:44] yeah any any other [01:06:47] towns programs I mean like [01:06:53] de yeah you he but are any of them based [01:06:57] on a percentage of Revenue or are they [01:06:59] pilot negoti Reven twist okay that's [01:07:05] all well I think that's what everyone's [01:07:07] having the hardest time with so maybe if [01:07:09] we can really look at that [01:07:12] and you [01:07:16] know just do some other things tax [01:07:20] exempt they property tax exempt [01:07:28] so our meetings would be the 13th and [01:07:31] 27 correct sorry what we that's okay our [01:07:35] meetings the 13th and the 27th okay [01:07:41] um the 13th is already getting pretty [01:07:43] full just yeah no I don't want it to be [01:07:45] on a regular meeting night what about [01:07:47] Tuesday the [01:07:52] 7th no [01:07:56] not here [01:07:58] um Tuesday the [01:08:01] 14th not here [01:08:10] um I can't do the six the 20th is Martin [01:08:13] Luther King day we can't it's a holiday [01:08:16] I already looked at that one yeah the [01:08:20] 21st I I'm open on the 21st but Chris [01:08:24] are you back yeah I can do the 14th and [01:08:26] I can do this we can do the 14th or the [01:08:29] 21st yeah what's [01:08:33] um I can do either this is January by [01:08:36] yeah do you want to do the 21st so it's [01:08:38] not two meetings in a row [01:08:41] sure um so are people going to send me [01:08:44] their comments and then I'll compile [01:08:46] them yes and ship them out yes can can [01:08:50] you post my meeting too yeah I'll post [01:08:52] your meeting do you want to do 5:30 [01:08:54] again does that work for everybody [01:09:05] are you going to start having regular [01:09:06] meetings we thinking about [01:09:09] it um but just really [01:09:13] quick before [01:09:15] um before we adjourn I just want Justin [01:09:20] to bring up [01:09:22] um so that everyone's aware that we are [01:09:26] likely going to owe [01:09:27] zikos for not doing the [01:09:30] auction for cost incurred plus [01:09:36] 12% um pretty much that's it so um [01:09:39] whatever the board wants to decide [01:09:41] moving forward I didn't have the numbers [01:09:43] at the last meeting so I kept my mouth [01:09:44] shut but if the board does choose to go [01:09:47] in a different direction or do nothing [01:09:49] um what is was supposed to cost the town [01:09:51] nothing is is going to end up costing us [01:09:54] whatever they've spent thus far [01:09:55] are plus 12% uh and I don't know if that [01:09:58] includes timeing time you don't have a [01:10:00] number on that I don't know I haven't [01:10:03] talked to them I was waiting to talk to [01:10:04] you guys yeah have they stopped [01:10:07] incurring costs they haven't heard from [01:10:09] me at all I don't know what the board [01:10:10] wants to do that's why because we just [01:10:13] paused what kind of cost um anything for [01:10:16] advertising materials time sign whatever [01:10:20] Plus [01:10:22] 12% I just wanted to make people aware [01:10:24] of that CU a cost of doing everything [01:10:27] because we're going to have to figure [01:10:28] out where that money comes from so that [01:10:31] cuz it would be a breach of their [01:10:32] contract so just so everyone's [01:10:36] over when did you when when was the [01:10:39] contract signed I don't know that I want [01:10:41] to say roughly three months ago but [01:10:42] don't quote me [01:10:44] exactly do you think maybe not [01:10:47] quite what do you think was it has it [01:10:51] been that I just I don't know I time is [01:10:53] like a I know [01:10:57] okay that was all I wanted to add to to [01:10:59] the end [01:11:02] here I guess we [01:11:04] should we have [01:11:10] sign I make a motion [01:11:13] to oh you can make a motion to aurn [01:11:16] sure I didn't know I thought you wanted [01:11:18] to say something else so I yes [01:11:22] 6:42 5:31 6:42 you need a sec I think [01:11:25] it's second [01:11:27] 641 all in [01:11:37] favor oh okay I'll start on these [01:11:58] [Music] [01:12:10] said [01:12:12] [Music] [01:12:46] do it all day at [01:12:55] so [01:13:00] double double the amount yes I'm trying [01:13:03] I'm going to take my lunch yes I will be [01:13:05] here okay help [01:13:09] me can I bring a [01:13:19] swap said